VIEWER FEEDBACK
ESH - Viewer opinions on any Shows, Activities, Rules etc within the Equine Community
Viewer feedback on various concepts/ideas within our industry. Contact ESH with your thoughts - names can be witheld.


Monday 14th December 2009:-
Topics - All aspects of Horse Events, Showing - your thoughts.

Emails received directly to ESH - they are not edited in any way unless advised to author prior to generalise the post. ALL NEW Feedback will be added to the top of each column as information is received by ESH. We welcome all opinions. Emails containing foul language, personal attacks in naming individuals will not be published nor replied to by ESH Staff  NEW Viewer feedback posts start at the top of this page.



NEW - Topic - Are coloured horses 'discriminated' in breed classes & Fierce Ponies- Response (14/12/09)
Well said Hawkesbury Park Show Horses!  I've yet to see ONE Judge come forward and explain why it so often the rule of thumb that 'unrideable' Riding Ponies who go around so fiercely and unhappily, who are forced into a horribley unatural frame (which would be quite excruiating to maintain) are rewarded for this. We do dressage and hacking with our ponies, it is interesting that we do exceptionally well in dressage, yet in hacking we only get occassional broad sash with Judges who remark first: "I'm so impressed you did that in a snaffle" and "I just loved the way  you worked so harmoniously". (Well we don't always achieve the 'harmonious' bit when the girls are in season, but we try.... :-) ) It's interesting to say the least, watching fierce ponies who are asked to do a lengethed trot and simply speed up more, still generally win. When (some) Judges ask a lengthened trot, do they actually know what to look for? I think it is so sad that ponies/horses who conduct themselves in a relaxed and kind manner (which is a reflection on their rider and training) are not rewarded more. We had one Judge ask us was our Pony only beginning her showing career as she was entering the ring because she was being ridden in a snaffle in an open class . Uh, no, it's because we keep her in that as she is doing novice dressage and will NOT be placed in a double until reaching a medium level. I would suggest ALL Judges read the new dressage tests and see what is required of horse/rider to do in a snaffle up to elementary level. (not that it is not impossible to abuse a horse in the mouth in a snaffle).

At the very least, PLEASE start taking note the length of curb and the angle it's at when the horse is going around, start looking at the severity of that angle and ask yourself "Why does that rider need that curb to be at that angle in a simple workout?" Severe curb angles constantly maintained should be penalised, yet so often these horses are rewarded.  In this enlightened era, when there is SO MUCH information and outrage (particularly in the dressage world) against what is largely percieved as nothing short of abuse, that STILL overbitting and harsh hands are too often the winners, it's just wrong. I have nothing against double bridles being used on educated horses with education informed riders who know what they are doing, but I would ask those particular Judges who obviously do not ride themselves; haven't for many years or limited riding experience becomed more informed because in the end run, its our beloved equine friends who suffer for it. Name Witheld

NEW - Topic - Are coloured horses 'discriminated' in breed classes- Response (10/12/09)
I have read with interest the opinions of people re the whole coloured horse argument and whether or not there is bias.  We breed and show multi registered buckskin ponies & galloways and I can honestly say, I have never felt that our horses have been discriminated against due to their colour in either breed or open pony hack or hunter classes.  I have however, felt strongly discriminated against by very obvious and very pro ‘riding pony’ judges where manners and confirmation come a distant second to the breed of the animal!  Fierce ponies, levered to the hilt in their bits, chins on chests nearly pulling the rider out of the saddle winning pony hack classes just because they are a Riding Pony, forget the fact that are very nearly an ‘Unrideable Pony’. Well done CM from NSW for doing so well on your lovely horse, but I do not agree that it is ‘rubbish’ that hacks in particular are discriminated against.  I think it will take a long time for ‘the old school’ to consistently change and take off their ‘coloured’ glasses and place horses on their merits and not on their colour. I also agree with Kim, SA that it appears still that only palomino’s and buckskins are generally more accepted and more common place in pony and to a lesser degree galloway classes and the other coloured breeds are less common.  We have and will continue to campaign our coloured’s in open classes, reap the rewards and most of all love and enjoy them!!!  Hawkesbury Park Show Horses, NSW

NEW - Topic - Gala Horse Show Championships and Open Show Wagga Wagga - Response (10/12/09)
Yes, CONGRATULATIONS to the Dilutes Australia Committee (ACT & NSW) on a super Championships Show held in Wagga over the weekend.Especially to Sarah Boothey (Lovell) and Jacqui Knobel. They're tireless efforts before the Show provided fabulous prizes, trophies, garlands and ribbons for all sections - thanks to the many sponsors. The indoor area was lovely and we were able to all park close by, which really makes the day easier. I will certainly be attending the event next year. J.L.

NEW - Topic - Ribbons at Shows - Response (10/12/09)
Further to the comments by J.M about Ribbons at Pre-enter Shows. I have also seen this at a number of top level Shows this spring. We pay alot to pre-enter these events and the money is taken by the Committee's well in advance. It costs no extra to have class names printed on the ribbons (I order all the ribbons for Horse Events at our local Show), just a little effort in getting a list to the ribbon company. There is a certain prestige at winning at these higher level events, and to take home a generic ribbon is a poor reminder of a great win. Name Witheld

I have not heard such rubbish in my whole live. I campaign a colored hack. She has done exceedingly well in the Open Showing world. So well in fact that she has qualified for Melbourne and Adelaide Royals every year for the past 3 years. Yes she is a Show Hunter but does win Champions under saddle in the Open Classes when no Show Hunter classes are available. If you cannot overlook a horse's color and judge quality, movement, presence and manner then you should not be a judge. I will admit when l first started to put her out in the Open Classes it was hard but l persevered and l feel that they are accepted. I show my colored horses and ponies every week and in the last couple of years l have never felt out of place. Come on fellow colored horse owners the only way you are going to change the bias is to be out and about doing it. If at the end of the day you feel you have done your best then you are still a winner. Move over black, brown, chestnut the new in fashion Show Horse is colored. Have attached a photo (click here to view >> ) so you can see for yourself. This Hack has been judged by our local judges and overseas judges. CM  NSW

Congratulations to Dilutes Australia NSW/ACT Branch for running the Gala Coloured Show Championships and Open Show this weekend at Wagga Wagga. Jacqui  and her committee worked very hard to run this show, especially as Jacqui herself lives in Canberra, so for her it wasn’t just around the corner. Everything ran smoothly and was a very friendly show to compete at. The Charles Sturt University Equine facilities were wonderful, especially the indoor arena. The weather was perfect  around 27 degrees both days as we had dreaded what the temperatures might have been. We travelled from the Central Coast (6 hours) to attend but others had come from Victoria and South Australia. The show had great sponsorship and prizes and plenty of classes to enter and the Open show ran an extensive open and breed rings.  Again, congratulations Jacqui for all your time spent organising this fantastic event. I hope you had some time to enjoy yourself and take in the atmosphere, we all often take these dedicated committee members for granted not realising the amount of time and effort which goes into running a show , especially a country show. Well done Dilutes Australia. Diane and Tiffany White

In response to Tiffany from NSW, sticking to breed classes with coloured horses does not help change public perception. It avoids the problem which wont change without showing in open events or all breeds that the horse is eligible for. I totally agree however that "if a coloured horse has the conformation, movement and class of any solid coloured horse, there should be no discrimination". I do think that pallies and buckskins are more accepted in the pony rings than the bigger horses (and are generally of equivalent quality as the non-coloured ones). Sadly, the coloured horse in the open ring has to be much better than the others in the open classes for judges that have a bias to seriously consider giving them a ribbon. The more that biased judges and spectators see other judges giving the wins to the best horse, despite the colour, the more likely that public perception will change and colour will not be a consideration when judging.  I have a pinto that I have not yet shown under saddle (plan to in open hunter classes). She has multiple breed registrations and in led classes I have had some judges say, I really don't like coloured horses, but I do like your horse and they give her the win (and champion and supreme). There are some judges that will look past their own colour bias if the horse is truly a good horse. To those with coloured horses, stick with it and try the open classes and breed classes and help make it more acceptable to show coloured animals.  I don't think it is impossible to do well with a coloured horse (in particular a pinto or appaloosa) but I do think it is harder to do well consistently, due to some judges preferring plain colours. Kim ,SA

Hi Emma, Well at the very least I will give a nod to the person who says as a Judge they don't think they ever placed a coloured horse over a solid colour, at last confirmation that discrimination does occur.  I do have to strongly disagree with the anti-colour stance.  I've seen some coloured horses with faultless confirmations and exceptional paces that STILL can't get a look in over 'solid' coloured horses which is ridiculous. In one class on the south coast there were about eight, out of the eight there was a grey and pinto, the grey probably could be faulted for a slightly too long back and the pinto was stunning. The other six were solid coloured, one dark brown was really the stand out performer and won, the rest went round  individually either on the wrong leg, rushed, overbent, did awful transitions, mini rears (all seen by the Judge). The pinto didn't do a clean walk to canter (but other than the solid brown and grey, neither did the rest) and the grey was pretty seamless but didn't have as nice a movement as the solid brown and pinto.  Yes, you guessed it, pinto and grey out of the placings. How can any Judge seriously be so COLOUR BLIND to the detriment of the equine world?  Are some rewarding crappy performances over good performances based on colour? Unbelievable. IN open ridden classes colour SHOULD NOT enter into a performance based area and how does public perception change unless Judging perceptions change and they give credit where credit is due. (Pity the person that as a coloured arab type!!)

There is a fair bit of ignorance amongst some Judges, dare I add, I witnessed an acquaintance trying to enter a part welsh ridden on a buckskin once and the Judge refusing entry (despite this pony being multi-breed registered) saying they had to stick to the coloured rings. Second Judge was called and (surprise, surprise) concurred with first Judge.  Said acquaintance offered to get the papers: part welsh;  part-bred AP etc to no avail- for once and all people: Colour Is Not A Breed!!!  Correct me if I"m wrong, but you can get  welsh ponies who are coloured, thoroughbreds who are coloured, quarter horses who are coloured etc etc but they are ALL different confirmational types, with completely different movement and bred for different purposes. They are a breed, bred to type whose genetics dictate what colour hair covers them. It wasn't too long ago where, for example, German Shepherd Dogs born white were killed at birth by some breeders. Not because they weren't true to type confirmationally and temperamentally, simply because white was deemed unacceptable despite photographs dating back decades upon decades indicating that white GSD's were part and pacel of the breed. Some breeders who had a conscience would place them in pet homes rather kill them. HOwever (and I may stand corrected), I do believe that white GSD's cannot be shown, simply based on the colour, even today. I just don't get the 'colour thing'. Anyway, time to step down from the podium and hope common sense prevails one day. Name Witheld

This is a very good point that this person has raised and one i also feel very strongly about. I have shown palominos for many years now but only as breed horses due to this discrimination that takes place. I feel for this person with the pinto horse as they are discriminated against MORE than palominos and buckskins. Although in recent times Palominos have become the new"Black" with more and more being seen in breed classes and show hunters they still get beaten at the post when it comes to the major awards. Many times i have seen beautiful, well schooled show hunter ponies out work anything in that class and be unplaced in the event. Why should this be? It shouldn't matter if they are pink with purple stripes, if a coloured horse has the confirmation, movement and class of any solid coloured horse, there should be no discrimination. My palomino is a riding pony. I have been told  by many people that if he was brown he'd probably do quite well in show hunter events because  he can move better than anything I've seen. My advice, stick to breed classes until public perception is gradually changed. Tiffany, NSW

As a judge - I'm very sorry but in open classes I really don't believe I have ever placed a coloured horse over a solid colour hack/pony etc. In my opinion everything is taken into account from Type, confirmation, paces, manners etc and Type for me is very important. I guess in short what I am saying is a bay or chestnut will always go in the line first. To be shot twice, in colour terms I am also not a fan of grey horses so it's not just Pally's Pinto's or the like. Whilst when growing up I did own a Pally, however my tastes have changed and really coloured horses also get additional breed and colour classes, unlike open horses. I dont believe I am alone in this, although congratulation everyone owning a coloured horse and wish them enjoyment. Name Witheld QLD

Yes, I would say unfortunately discrimination does exist in non-breed classes but of course it shouldn't. The "colour" of a horse should, in 'open'  classes have no bearing in results, especially ridden, because it should be totally performance based.  I've seen pintos, roans, greys, palominos, appaloosas (not so much darker buckskins though, go figure ??) all very obviously discriminated against. (I don't own one).  In the past we competed with a grey and it worked for us both ways. Some Judges clearly had a soft spot for greys and we did exceptionally well and others detested her, like she didn't even get a look in (as did other greys in the class). I had to say it, but I've also seen arabians discriminated against too, particularly those more true to arab type in confirmation. Maybe it's a case of Judges like a certain look or not, but in ridden that shouldn't come in to it at all! (No I don't own an arabian). Actually, it makes my blood boil as a spectator/bystander when a coloured or arabian horse CLEARLY is the pick of the class but barely rates a second glance.
Again, SOME Judges need to rethink their judging techniques so the hack world isn't full of bays,browns,blacks and dark chestnuts . (I own all four colours!) Name Witheld ACT

People are not going to pay to get their horse classified as a show hunter at the begining of the year. It is up to the judge and competitors to determine whether or not your horse is a show hunter or not. The Australian Hunter Horse Association is trying to make a change in the hunter world, and they are doing a good job of it. Support them if you want to help. I don't think you should blame committees and associations like the NSW Arabian society. Those classes are put in the program for fun and because some arabians ARE a hunter type. I have a partbred arabian who is 50% and does extremely well in open show hunter classes. If you don't like it, don't enter it. Name Witheld NSW

Hi Emma, regarding this question, I was always under the impression that a hack was of Thoroughbred breed or type and that's why coloured horses were not "excepted" in the hack ring.  Obviously the breed acceptance is changing, (although very slowly in some states), and it takes a very strong judge to pick a coloured horse over a solid colour in a EA class!  Coloured horses shouldn't be discriminated in breed classes though, but again, remember it is the judges' opinion, whether you like it or not.  At the end of the day, you have to enjoy your showing, as you put so much money  and hard work in the sport with little reward!! M.W. SA

Cuirousity has got the better of me again, see I own a pinto, I am just in the process of registering him to the pinto society, but what I was wondering was, are they 'disciminated' in other breed classes as well? because really if you think about it, a pinto in an open hack ring, if it was performing nicely wouldn't be choose, over a straight coloured pony. Hunter classes are slightly more leaneant, but I with a coloured pinto I am not so sure. As my pinto pony is a part arab, would he be discriminated because he is coloured like the open hack ring? I am also wondering if someone could tell me why coloured horses are 'discriminated' in the open hack rings? and why judges will not choose them? or is it a 'myth' that they won't be choosen? I would love to hear feedback regarding this and if pinto's are 'discriminated' in breed classes other then there own. Name Witheld

Hi Emma,  I have just competed at the a Large Pre-Enter show and wanted to put a couple of ideas out there for discussion.
1. Cost of entries - Each class at this show cost $15 to enter. I was disappointed that the ribbons presented were of poor satin quality and the champion/reserve champ ribbons were narrow and not of a quality that we receive at local agricultural shows. Surely at $15 a class at a big show, we competitors deserve a little more for our money.
2. Timetabling - several competitors missed their classes as the judge decided to pursue with the program and not stick to the times allocated for classes. Why timetable if you don't stick to it? Does anyone else have opinions on these issues ? J.M

I have just returned from a Large Breed Championships.  I have 2 Welsh  that are double reg. Arabian Ponies.  One is a true Hunter type the other definitely isn't. The NSW Arabian Horse Association are just as much at fault as any show Committee because they have classes such as Novice Arabian Show Hunter, Arabian Stallion Show Hunter, Arabian Mare Show Hunter, Arabian Gelding Show Hunter, honestly, when have you ever seen a Purebred Arabian looking like a Show Hunter?????? My pony was in a Derivative Show Hunter class along with Arabian Riding Ponies (I don't think so) Arabian Warmbloods, just because they are big doesn't automatically say that they are Hunter type.  Someone commented a few weeks ago that at the beginning of every year you should have to register your Show Hunter.This being the case Show Committees shouldn't accept entries unless these Horse and Ponies are registered. Shows on the day should  sight your Hunter registration papers. We should even go to the point of having some people as classifiers to make sure they are classified correctly then all these arguments would cease.  I can't enter my ponies in certain classes and they should be made to do the same, don't they have enough classes to enter in.  Judges should also have to watch English Hunter classes and they would then know what a true Hunter type is, not want they think it should be, as is the case now.  I would be more than happy to pay for this Hunter registration because it would put to an end once and for all this debacle of people entering in the wrong classes. Name Witheld NSW

Personally I dont like to be disrespectful to a show society by throwing our minor place ribbons out but we have literally ended up with bags and bags of them. Wouldnt it make sense for all shows to start offering a ribbon recycling box, where those who don't want their ribbons as long as the ribbon has remained clean and uncreased, can pop them in the box before they leave the show, whilst those who want to keep their ribbons can.  Would save ribbons being thrown out by the competitor who does not really want them, while the show society can save money by not having to order as many ribbons for the next show and the competitor who treasures every ribbon gets to take theirs home.  Name Witheld, QLD

Sorry but I feel completely insulted that a Royal Show can care so little about the people that provide entertainment for the general public to see!! Like someone below said, the dog people get to find out their judges, so does the cows, cats etc but only the Horse people are not told. So you don't have all the judges, well at least let us know who you do have, it just goes to show the RAS is money hungry! To publish them now a week after closing of entries is just not fair. RAS of NSW - if you don't want us, please just say and save us 12 months of work every year - we'll go someone else instead. Upset hackie QLD

I really don't want to stir things up, but this is my passion and with regard to Name With Held (no State) - Hunters v Hacks - The Hunters in Australia are improving every year. You are right though, judges DO NEED EDUCATION, if they have NOT Hunted! Those of us that have, and are dedicated Hunter owner/enthusiasts, read English write-ups and look at types from English Shows and continue to try to learn and improve our judging knowledge, and keep up "with the Joneses" so to speak, and no it doesn't cut it that there is an AUSTRALIAN Hunter, cause guess what, everyone wants their retiring Hacks to be one. Let's get true type (with quality) and there are 3 types, light, medium and heavyweight and they are NOT Hacks!! I have competed on both Hacks (for many years) and they ARE NOT the same type, nor is the same expected of them for their respective workouts.I can't believe that soooo many judges are having trouble with this, when it is clearly stated, in the AHHA guidelines (based on English rules) , what the bone requirements are, and what the type needs to be. The Hack is different!   Jan  WA

Show hacks and show hunters are traditionally two very different types. Judges perhaps need more education on what constitutes a true Show Hunter. Type is one of the prime prerequisites for a show hunter as are manners.  To judge by the english standards all of the hunter type horses would automatically start higher in the lineup than the hack. A bit like putting an arab in a quarter horse class = it may be a very correct confirmational type for an arab but it is not correct for a quarterhorse. Perhaps the specifications for type need to be set out clearly and a list of priority points for the class set out for the judge ie; Confirmation type .... Manners,... Paces ... Unfortunately Australia does not yet have large numbers of competitors of true hunter type with excellent manners and trained to perform the high quality of workout you would expect.  Having heavyweight hacks compete in the classes and win does not encourage more of the correct type of competitors. However, It must be very difficult for the judge when nearly all of your entries in the hunter class are  classical hunter type but the one horse who is not hunter but a heavywight hack, is the one who has the best manners and works the best. A mediocre (not bad) worker of hunter type should still beat a very nice worker of heavy hack type if it is soft and kind to ride. It must have Manners and be pleasant to ride,  NOT necessarily as well educated. Name Witheld

So far have not had any royal shows state that they are reducing horse numbers. (I checked) Whats wrong with a two ring show where all get to compete for champion and supreme. The Ag Societies consider all champions the same no matter what ring they are won in. Surely if some one wants to go to all the trouble and expense of competing at a Royal after only winning at small shows or against little competition, let them, it will be a very steep learning curve for them when they come up against the top competitors.  If there was no point trying then showing numbers would pretty soon disappear, closely followed by most of the shows that people qualify at. Everyone desrves the chance to try and qualify for a royal and it is not up to some competitors to say who is up to the standard. That is supposed to be why we have judges. Bronk

Dear Emma. I read your comments on the Second Ring stigma and totally agree. However, I think the show organisers inadvertently add to the stigma case by boldly announcing, as happened at our show last week, that “Those unfortunate not to gain First place in the first ring can have another chance in the second ring.”  Whilst the announcement was a fact, the tone and mentioning “unfortunate” very much indicated a stigma against the second ring. 
H.C. NSW

Dear ESH. What rubbish is all this about Second Chance rings to gain points for a royal show. Do you think the Royals are dumb ?  The moment they see an increase in competitors gaining the required points, UP will go the qualifying bar for the next year. The Royals are trying to cut the numbers down so lets get rid of these so called Second Chance classes and get down to the real and true winners going forward to the Royals. and not including Second Chancers !!  Clair, NSW

Hi ESH. Re Second Chance Ring.  As it is now becoming the norm to hold , dreaded words, Second Chances, to gain Royal performances at the end of the season, why simply not just draw up the show program with two rings offering First places, without any mention of “Second Chance”.  That way it just becomes part of the normal show program and no-one thinks any wiser of it. Name Witheld

Actually your right, there is a bit of an attitude when it comes to the other rings when everyone says to you that you HAD to go in the other ring to win. It's not right. We have 3 kids, some ponies in the same height class so we have no option but to put one pony in one right and another pony in the 2nd ring. Thanks for helping to let people see it differently. Name Witheld NSW

Sorry but I agree with everything you say except for allowing everyone in Supreme Awards, that should just be kept for the first ring winners otherwise there's just too many in them and they take far too long at the end of a big day already. Most sometimes do think of them a second chances, which they are but perhaps not thinking of the aspect that some competitors didn't compete in the first round. Name Witheld VIC

Well said Emma! I do believe there is a stigma attached, and it needs to be addressed. A friend of mine has a small pony and a galloway (like myself) and when we go to the same show we always work out who will compete in which ring, as to give our horses the best chance of winning! Is that to say our horses who compete in the second ring, are second best? Certainly not! Thanks for bringing this up! And in regards to a points system at Sydney Royal... I recall this topic being brought up on this forum some time ago. Unfortunately, I think it would take an insider from Sydney Royal to actually start to change things. Wouldn't it be nice though! -NSW Showie

I've been asked by quite a number of viewers and competitors recently to start a post regarding the stigma that is attached to 2nd Chance Rings, particular here in NSW.  Unlike other states, there seems to be the mentality in NSW that 2nd Rings, that offer additional chances are being regarding as consolation type classes for those who may not have won a perfornance in classes held earlier in the day.  When this is not exactly the case.

For Example the ESH Team attended the recent Gosford Show where there was 2 Chances at Championships for all Open Classes, it was a terrific program and one which I would love to see adopted at many other shows. In our case for instance, we witnessed the first lot of galloway classes being run, which we did not compete in due to arriving at the grounds later in the morning. We saw a number of beautiful galloways all present for the judge and the Championship being awarded. We, long with a number of other competitors then later in the day presented ourselves to the 2nd Ring to be judged in various open classes. Included in the competitors were some with larger show teams that have to structure their day with many horses and fit them into various rings, as well as other competitors who simply chose to compete later in the day or also arrived late due to the weather. The stigma attached to 2nd rings is 'Oh how come you didn't win in the first ring" or "Pity you have to slum it to get a second rate performance" - We need to change this way of thinking as it is not always the case and when reading results, we should not assume the 2nd round ring was full of "Loosers"!!

I know and have seen in VIC for example, many competitors work together to assist their horses gaining performances, and they talk to one another about who is going in what ring, and so on. Other states that have 2 and 3 rings circus's don't seem to view a 3rd Round Championship as a lesser award and in fact include all Championship winners in Supreme Hacks, not just the first round winners. Another example I share is, when competing this weekend I saw someone who I knew required an additional performance, and offered that we work together and along with others, divided the classes we would all compete in to allow each other the best chance of winning. I certainly didn't mind. Lets face it, at this time of year, the blue ribbon is really what we all need when going to the show!  Yes we are all against each other, but why can't we work together as well, it's still the judges decision at the end of the day but banding together can sometimes help everyone and make for a better day and smiles!

I also liked the ruling at this event stating that First Place Winners in Open events can not compete in the additional rings, when many shows stipulate that only Champions can't compete - well what is the point in that? When you can only put down one performance from one show anyway - it really does make sense that Open winners then become ineligible for the other rings. I also believe that Shows should adopt additional classes for Show Hunters, why are they penalised for supporting the shows, but unlike Open Horses, only have one chance and mostly one class, not even a Childs or Adults. We have written many amendments in programs for a number of shows recently and offer any committee that would like to increase the attendance they have at their show Contact ESH and we will help in creating programs that benefit everyone.

So - at the end of the day, please try to not consider classes held later in the day at shows as consolation events. They are not, sometimes can cater for more quality horses than seen in the earlier rings, and shouldn't be discounted from Supreme's if time permits. A Championship is not given lightly, so it should be considered a great win whether held at 9.30am or 3pm on a show day. Good luck to eveyone in upcoming events. Emma Rudder - ESH


I see that most just like me enjoy getting ribbions at shows, and if they don't they simply donate them back to the society, I really thank those who do donate them back even, so people like me who love getting them can still get them! Should I be write to the show society involved and copy in feedback on here? Should I put a sugguestion to the society about doing a raffle and entry via ribbions? At the show they did assure me it was only a trail, my fear is that they will make it permenante and that more societies will see that and follow suit! Looking forward to some suggestions on how to 'tackle' this issue :)
Name Witheld

Many thanks go to Helen Kirton, Leah Walsh and the uncomplaining group of helpers that make this show possible. Without our volunteers, we would not have wonderful shows such as these. I believe that FF show has been running since the early 1930’s – what an effort. It was also nice to see the various dignitaries who came to support the show, and again, this support is due to the efforts of the committee, for taking the show to the people. Good on you guys, keep up the good work. Name withheld - Sydney

Hi Emma, I just wanted to say what a well run show the NSW Country Hack Championships at Dubbo is! This was our first year competing there, as normally it clashes with the APSB Nationals, and we found everything to be very organised and the facilities excellent (especially the stable complex and parking)! It was extremely helpful having the committee in matching t-shirts so that you know who to approach with a question! Who would have thought that only one person on the marshelling could handle it so efficiently! Regular updates over the PA ensured that competitors could run on time, and the prizes were great, especially the rugs! So thanks committee! You were fantastic and we'll be back again next year! -Brooke Stevenson, NSW


Hi Emma
This is my first email to you. I read all the comments re judges for Sydney Royal. The RAS has never and will never release judges names prior to entry for two reasons.
1: They don't have any yet
2: Why should they?
Does anyone winging about the RAS really believe that so and so won't enter or so and so will enter because they know who is judging. I stopped showing at Sydney Royal in 1995 after competing there for 30 years and I don't remember knowing any judges names until a few weeks before the show and I don't remember anyone pulling out because they didn't like the judges. Remember there's only one winner but to get yourself and your horse qualified, accepted  and competing at Sydney is something to be proud of. Enjoy yourself at the show, relish the experience and you never know who might judge you. Maybe some new names could be on the horizon. Name Witheld NSW

Hi Emma, love the person who is asking us all to email and fax the RAS and not to be worried about putting our names to it or being called Trouble Makers - however has requested to be Name Witheld on your site!! Of course the RAS look at this page, they told us!  I have emailed them and asked nicely on behalf of the equine community, or asked them to consider refunds for those not wishing to compete. Thanks. A.W.  QLD

It seems  everyone that has posted about Sydney Royal (and I could be wrong) who have tried to find out who Judges were haven't been actually told that Judges haven't been finalised. Regardless, entry closing dates require reviewing so that competitors know who is Judging what and it really isn't fair that those with 'connections' can find out and make their informed decision to enter or not, but those lesser mortals don't get to know. That just stinks. There are lots of reasons people may not compete under a certain Judge: Conflict of interest; repeated bad experiences; knowing that for whatever reason the Judge in question whom you've competed under just doesn't really like your horse (not saying that its wrong, but it's just a fact of life that we accept); knowing that your fellow competitor is on 'over-familiar' terms; etc.  etc.

I know we compete under various Judges and our favourites are not necessarily the ones that give us the win {although that is preferable :-)   }, but knowing that the Judge will assess you regardless of who you are. Even sometimes not getting a place, but knowing you were beaten by others who worked better and placed accordingly leaves us feeling okay. Everyone talks about corruption in the horse world and biased Judging, it's just a fact. You can  have the Judge rave about your horse, how it clearly out-performed others in your class within earshot of the "big names" but  I'm giving it to "this one" because it has a nicer head". (Not of course, because they regularly rub shoulders with said Big Name and you don't) You can believe in yourself all you want, but some time that counts for diddly squat! It's not jealousy, because there are big names we look at in awe and they deserve their wins based on knock out riding and performances, but geez there are a fair few who can go around cringingly bad and still get that big sash! It's like somebody previously posted on ESH feedback, all the 'minor' players can name EXACTLY who is going to win what  class with what Judge even before stepping a hoof into the ring. I feel sorry for those who go to the great expense (not us) of entering the Royal only to know with a sinking heart that they don't stand a chance months before the event. Name Witheld NSW

Hi ESH- I think this is a wonderful idea! I Love it. Let's hope everyone else does also and the Royal adopt our feedback. James - NSW

I have to agree with the original viewer now. I looked through results and clearly saw horses that were open at the beginning of the year and are now showing as show hunters. Very odd. What makes you change in a few months. It certainly brings many questions to mind. Name Witheld VIC

Hi Emma, I would like to congratulate name withheld from SA.  I am glad someone finally pointed out that judges would not yet even be finalised.
Why did it take someone from out of our State to point this out? I am not on the RAS committee but I know they have not finalised Judges.  So how will faxing the RAS and sending them letters get you an answer when they dont know all the judges that have excepted invitations themselves yet? If it depends on who judges to weather you enter or not maybe everyone who is concerned should do a ring around to all the top competitors and see if they are entering, and if they are and there liable to worry you or most probably beat you, you shouldnt enter then either. And don't  forget that if a judge you like is judging maybe the other competitors wont compete because they think you will win, so that would be a great show, one judge with only the few horses they really like in each class,  Why bother having the Show then, There can only be one winner and alot of losers, so if you truly believe in your self and your horse go and compete no matter who is judging and if you ride well and perform well then be happy with that and go home and give yourself a big rap at how well you performed and forget about all the entry money you lost, because you wont get that back by winning anyway and Remember there is only ONE blue ribbon per class, So who cares if you get it or not you have been good enough to Qualify for Sydney Royal that is better than most of us can do. Name witheld NSW

In response to Show Hackie NSW's concern regarding hacks going to hunters - my response is that if they are winning over other hunters in that division then surely they are worthy of the prize.  Just because a horse is a classic hunter type, doesnt make it the best.  Obviously the judges, who are all royal panel judges regard these horses you are referring to as worthy winners or else they wouldnt be there.  Now days, with the 3 judge score card, 3 individual opinions of what the winners should be is taken into account - all 3 cant be wrong!  In my experience it goes both ways.  As shows dont supply enough hunter classes to qualify for sydney, hunters are forced into the open ring.  if they are the best horse in the judges opinion, then they win.  It cuts both ways!  Until there is an agreed classification or nomination of either and both shc and efa and all breed associations agree to it, then it will remain the same. In the mean time - let the best horse on the day win and leave the connections to their accolades!  Name Witheld NSW

Hi ESH - I've recently viewed in your results sections, and for all states, many horses and top ones at that, going from their Open Classes to now appearing in Show Hunter results. Surely a mature aged horse can just all of a sudden change bone structure and become a Hunter? It is just purely because now there are too many horses in these peoples classes and they aren't winning - so they just up and swap to Hunter Classes? Riding Pony Pony Hacks, Galloways and even some hacks that are all clearly not hunters, now competing and winning show hunter classes. I just wonder if the SHC and EFA should adopt policies of every competitor having to nominate their class and stick to it. I don't compete in Hunter, but I feel for those who do and those who have proper hunter type horses having to content with those who simply decide they aren't winning enough in open classes and jump ship with inappropriate horses. Thanks. Show Hackie NSW.

I have a suggestion - instead of every royal saying you need 7,8,50 first placings to qualify - perhaps each Royal should say "40 points" required to attend the show. That way people like me who live in rural areas and can't travel much or have limited shows to attend, and also keep getting second place to the same horse - can still qualify bases on the points throughout the year they do win. What do others think. Sam - SA

I have just been reading peoples thoughts on this I have been showing for many years and I am still proud of the ribbons I come home with I would be disappointed if I received nothing for my effort. I have kept every sash I have won over the years I have hundreds in bags away in the cupboard and I have walls plastered with Royal Show Champion sashes and garlands, and HOTY medals. Heather from NSW do you mean to say that if you won Champion at a royal show or a HOTY you would just throw these sashes in the bin as in your opinion they are rubbish. Don't you all rember the very first ribbon you came home with and how proud you were of it don't take this away from the people who still cherish or who are still tyring to win this  piece of rubbish
Deb Vic

Urgent request from a Viewer -  Please send letters or faxes to the NSW RAS advising of your frustratio about the lack of information being given to competitors regarding Judges listings for the 2010 Sydney Show. To date the Committee have advised that they have had no communication from competitors as to their concerns. They will not listen to any feedback on ESH that does not have names posted next to the concerns. If you don't wish to have your name published - then please fax or email the RAS pleading for them to release the judges names or your   thoughts/suggestions/complaints. I agree with John from Vic re take our money make us fill the arena for the great Grand Parades then cant give us the courtesy of listing the judges prior to entries closing. I know that most would be concerned about putting their names to this as they think they may get labeled trouble makers  but if we all do it they may get the message we are only doing it to make for a better show and better Competitor/RAS relationship and surely it would be  easier for their staff  to not have to send back refunds  etc etc what do we call it Constructive Criticism Surely we can also get  breed groups Hack groups etc to also send a letter in. Name withheld NSW

Well considering the cost of entries, travelling etc I think it's an individual decision whether to keep ribbons or not, after all if the average cost of each  ag show class is $6.00 (averaged out)  and there are usually  8 and up to 30 in each class, I would think entries cover prizemoney and ribbons well and truly. Children especially like them and those who aren't on show winning ponies (or don't  have 'the' name as sometimes the case is) treasure every hard fought for ribbon they get, I would hate this to be taken away from them. My daughter who is a teenager, still has her from ten years ago from various ponies and relates her memories with them. Again, if people choose to return them, great, but if they choose to keep them, great as well. We have attended a few shows where it is ribbon only and to tell you the truth if there were no ribbons and no prizemoney there's very little incentive left, especially for  the up and coming kiddies. I haven't any young children, but it still makes me smile to see a young child coming out of the ring with a huge grin,  brandishing the ribbon up in the air like they've just won Olympic gold! J - NSW

I think the show world should continue with ribbons at shows , Its ok for us people that are continual in the winning circle we can donate our unwanted ribbons back and most show societies now have a raffle for them , I myself donate back any ribbons but I keep the fat ones and put them on a hanger for each horse at home but for some people that ribbon can mean the world weather its blue , red or white , child or adult.. We need to remember that some people that do this sport are there for themselves , for fun and to improve what they do, Not everyone fights to make it to the big shows. S R.

This is a very interesting topic. I have often thought that ribbons are a complete waste of money.  We hand all our ribbons back, along with the fat ones, as it is such a waste  just putting them in the bin and it makes sense that the Shows can make use of them for the next year.  I know of others that sew them into rugs, hang them on the wall and put them in the stables, but inevitably they end up as rubbish.  I wonder what a good alternative would be?  Any Suggestions?  Heather NSW.

I like the 2 ring hacks shows, because it gives people more of a chance, it gives the rider a chance to be judged under a different judged (well in my experience at 2 ring shows anyway), Also if the rider is riding a horse that has gone well in novice and intermeidate but when it came to the open it didn't work well, therefore not placing, then the rider can work on the problem, and go again in the second round. Even when there are no compeitors in second round, and some might say they got an 'underderved win' well, the trainer I used told me that some compitors go out west to shows and because there aint many out there, then they baiscally automaticually gain entry into sydney royal, and baiscally they can say 'ive qualified for royals for years now' hey they might not go anywhere...but maybe they might work on getting better and better then eventually after a long time win it. Right at this stage I am only gaining automatic placings at shows, so second round gives me more experience in the ring, and a chance to get an idea of different workouts that may be asked. So therefore at home, I can have a practise at a workout that I might remember. Second ring shows also are great for people who have clashing classes or missed the first round for whatever reason. The only problem is with second round rings, is when the rules aren't fully stated, or when at some shows you can go in if you don't win open classes, then at some shows its if you place you can't go in... it is also a problem when riders go in who shouldn't be in it, or when fellow riders get confused into thinking they aren't able to go in when they actually are allowed to! But I believe more shows should have them, espeically ones that have lots of competitors in them. Bron

This weekend I went to a local show, I went in the first class, and discovered that ribbions were not being given out except for champion and reserve champion ribbions! Now I was very very very very disapointed and even heart brocken by this! I asked why they weren't being given out, and the reply was "where're trailing a new system and most riders are only chassing performances for royals", I said I wasn't happy about it, but other compeitors who were close by said 'no way i like it with no ribbions'! Now i can understand where the society is coming from espeically considering how many competitors don't want there place getting ribbions considering they go to so many shows, and get so many of them, but honestly what is a show without a champion, reserve, 1st 2nd 3rd and sometimes 4th (if lucky) ribbion? Why can't the society provide them? If compeitors don't want them, then they should seriously donate them back to the society should they not? I find it very interesting also how people won't throw out there champion ribbions and reserve ones...even if they have millions of them lying around....and I also find it interesting that they won't throw out the ones from royals either! But seriouly, imigine for a sheer minute, that you made it to a royal only to find that ribbions weren't being handed out to you....how would you feel? very upset I would imgine! Well that's how I feel! because don't I often get the opportunity to show much! I also don't have people on the ground for me taking photo's of me riding...so therefore, ribbions are my memory of the event! In my room, my ribbions are hung so that I can see when I got them and I can relate them to which horse I was riding! So please please please, I would like all shows to have ribbions, and I would like it also if compeitors don't think much of ribbions from a small show to donate them back to the society! rather then get home and chuck them in the bin!  Name Witheld NSW.

I would like to thank the SHC for such an enjoyable and well run weekend. I have attended many HOY over the past 20 or so years and I think this proved to be a very good format for the Open and Rider sections.  This has given the Competitors time to prepare horses and not try and be in two places at once, thus causing the classes to run behind time. This format also so gives everyone a chance to shine. Our future stars will be given the experience that only a chosen few have only been able to gain in the past. Congratulations to all the winners and placegetters for you success.  I must also congratulate our Pupils, Nell and Will Evans, Harriet Hooke, Maeve Lawson, Georgia Coffey and Lil Mills for their involvement and success over the weekend.  I am proud that you all stepped up to the mark and continue to improve. Lindy, Marena Stud.

I really love free workouts, especially for big competitions. I feel it allows the competitor the freedom to really show off their horses abilities rather than being restricted to a set figure of eight standard workout. I love the chance in a championship to really go for full stride. I think that large shows Grand Nationals, Royals and HOTY"s etc should adopt more of the same and have the finals of these events with free workouts. J.P

What other competitors think of the 2 ring Hack shows?  I do like them, even though i dont Hack any more. I know it gives other nice horses that have come second in their height classes in the first rings a chance to get a performance for Sydney show.  I do know that when there are two equally performed horses obviously the Judge can only award one the first ribbon, so in this case they are a great idea to allow others to win a height class on their equally deserving horse to. But what about out here in country NSW. I have seen 4 SHC shows in recent weeks and to my amazement the second ring only had 1 or 2 competitors in total.  Also at one of these shows the second chance ring did not even go ahead for the galloways. And the show hunter ring had one horse in it, the judge just gave her the first placings and put the champion ribbon on the horse.  So after competing at several shows and maybe striking a first at a smaller show where there is no competition plus hanging out for the second ring and winning several times over because you are the only horse there may give some horses the performances they need for sydney. Obviously it is a waste of time these horses going to sydney show but all the same gaining undeserved 1st placings seems a bit unfair as it is possible that by them entering for sydney some of the well performed horses that have busted their guts to get performances in high standard competition could miss out due to the easy way to get performances at some shows.  I remenber a long time ago, if you were the only one in a class and you were not performing well enough or your horse was simply not hack quality the tougher judges would hand out a 2nd ribbon only.  I can see the point that if you turn up you deserve to win but i can see that horses are easily gaining performances this way and when they compete against a decent standing of horses dont even get called in? Name Witheld NSW

Give Sydney Royal a Break people - they can't name Sydney judges if they don't have them. Ultimately you will still all enter no matter what anyway and they show knows that. We just need to put up. If you really think about it, it's their show, yes we pay to be competitors but I wonder if the Dog, Cat, Cow, Chicken judges etc are all kept from those competitors also. As horse people we need to stop being the burden for the entire show. Name Witheld SA

GVS, It's hard to do, but try not to take on nasty or mean spirited comments made by strangers/acquaintances , when it is so obvious that the venom laden words spat in your direction is fuelled by nothing more than petty jealousy and poor sportsmanship. Isn't it a frustratingly funny quirk of human nature that we allow people( who really don't matter in our lives or future)make us feel so crappy?  It's hard, but some options are, if it's out of the ring: turn around to this person and (tongue in cheek with a dash of sarcasm) politely thank them for their kind words and encouragement, then walk off; or tell them to take it up with the JUdge or (my personal choice) tell them "Apparently, Madam, you've mistaken me for somebody who gives a damn what you think". If it's in the ring, just ignore them, because that person is the one who looks pathetic and with a bit of luck the  Judge will hear them and give them a serve.
Keep going to shows, do your own thing and have fun with your horse! Name Witheld

Hi Em, I have just read the comments made by "GVS" and I must say I felt very angry and upset for them, at how someone could say such a thing about there horse to there face!  If someone ever said that about me and my horses I would have shot back and said something along the lines of a few swear words along with that "scared of a little competition are we?" and also I would have said to them with swear words added 'Grow up' and all those sort of things! I would also be very grumpy, upset and heart brocken! for a good while to!  Whyever someone would honestly even say something like that is behond me and really how dare they say such a thing! They have no right to say that! If that's what they think then they should keep there comments to themselves! Competitors like this really have no place in the showing world and really quite clearly don't derserve to win nor compete at high level either! Or maybe they just take winning for granted! whatever happened to being a good sport? But to GVS I say hang in there mate! hang in there, and don't worry bout what they say! keep going and enjoy showing horses! Cause I am sure your horse is a very beautiful horse and you worked very hard to get to where you are! :). Name Witheld NSW

I too have been subject to bad behavior by a fellow competitor at the last 4 shows I have taken my new hack to.  I have been away from the hack ring showing my Quarter Horse for 2 years, having been treated great by fellow competitors in this discipline it has been fantastic; and now have faced the complete opposite at the last 4 shows. At his first show ever under saddle on 2 September, he won Reserve Champion hack, and weren’t we happy to say the least, only to be faced by a disgruntled competitor remark to us when leaving the ring that he didn’t deserve to win.  Then 2 weeks later at our second show when he won Champion Novice hack the same lovely competitor walked up to me and said  my horse is rubbish (with some colourful words thrown in for good measure) and belonged in a tin of dog food, and said he only won at his first show because the judge was rubbish.(with some more colourful words)   Comments like this made me angry and very hurt to say the least, I was very close to throwing in the towel and putting my new horse up for sale.
Needless to say all my friends have rallied around me and talked me out of selling him.  He has won 8 broad ribbon sashes at his 4 shows competed, so he cannot be too bad, and all the judges can’t be wrong. I do not remember the Hack ring being this bad before and I have been showing for 25 years. It is terrible that such people do ruin it for others and give the hack ring such a bad name.   There are quite some nice people out there who do walk up to you and tell you that your horse deserved to win, what a lovely horse he is.  To those people I thank you, it is you that have kept me going through this turmoil in the last 6 weeks, and helped us celebrate our wins with this terrific horse. GVS

Hi Emma - The whole Royal debacle has just totally put me off competing this year. They believe they can do what they want and because we have already invested alot of time/money in performance we will just put up with it. I have forwarded an email concerning the judges direct to the RAS and they have informed me that if I can prove in writing a genuine conflict of interest a full refund will be issued however they do not consider that you just will not compete under a certain judge a conflict so fees will be forfieted. In these times, when money is tight, I believe this is just not acceptable. How hard is it to publish the judges names?????  I completely agree with 'Top Hackie' and 'Withheld NSW 15.10.09' that the only real way for them to take us seriously would be to either have some sort of legal action taken or to boycott the whole show!!!! I have also taken up with them about the time table with the Part Welsh and Part APSB. Again do you think they care we are told to choose. If I knew that at at the begining I wouldnt have troubled myself getting the performace in both registries. They are quick to take our money but what are we really getting for it!!!!!! Alot of heart ache. Totally Troubled And Fed Up Nsw

Sydney Royal sure opens the proverbial can of worms doesn't it? Well, since I have not attended Sydney Royal (usually to time, work and financial contraints-the trifecta!) I'm probably not that qualified to comment on the running of the Horse show itself. However, it seems quite unethical (and it would be interesting to see if it was illegal) to take money from competitors whilst refusing to disclose essential information. If I had issues, my first port of call would be the Department of Fair Trading or a Chamber Magistrate, what a shame it had to get to the stage were people are forced to feel like this. As for taking a uniformed stand, well, I believe the comment would be correct the RAS wouldn't care. Somebody suggested to me over 12 months ago that the RAS would prefer the majority, or all, horse events to be held at the SIEC and said that making life expensive and difficult for competitors would be one way to go to reduce entries to the point of Horse events being invalid. Afer all, the RAS only needs a handful of horses to keep the cityfolk happy. Interesting viewpoint that I intially dismissed, but now it seems to be a well and truly vaild statement to at least make one stop and think. Maybe if ALL 'animal' or 'rural' exhibits were to go 'bugger this' and turn the Royal into one giant amusement centre the RAS would sit up and take notice, but this is highly unlikely to happen. Name Witheld NSW

Competitor Bad Behaviour (9/10/09), I feel it is up to the Judge to ask the competitor to refrain from poor behaviour/eqtiquette or ask them to leave the ring.  The Committee also (according to rules and guidlines) can request the competitor in question to leave or refuse entry. It is very difficult as a competitor (and on an equal 'footing' to fellow cometitors) to put things in writing to complain about something that occurred days/weeks prior and you have to have dates;times;witness names, contact details etc and sometimes the very people that are to be complained about have contacts within the SHC.  Why can't the peson in charge of the ring, who at least is in a position of some sort power, deal with it then and there? (and have the full backing of the Committee).Other's should not have to put up with other competitors calling the shots of how a class/ring is run, it's plain rude and inconsiderate, but then people like that go through life walking all over everyone they come into contact with) Name Witheld NSW

Hi Emma - well I think all of us at NSW HOY so it first hand what this sport has deteriorated to. The completely disguisting event that took place is beyond words and believe. Why? Thank god there was no-one from overseas there to see how Australian's treat one another. Very Shocked NSW


Hi ESH - just wanted to say how good at show the SHC put on on Friday, although there were heaps of classes, it was great fun and it's always a really nice show to travel to. Many thanks - Name Witheld Southern NSW

I think it was fantastic that all competitors receive a workout. It's lovely to see a show respecting the efforts of competitors also with reasonable entry fees and opportunities given to all horses. Judges were very polite. Thanks SHC. Name Witheld NSW

Hi Emma, Would like to add my thoughts to the viewer feedback section. In response to “Top Hackie (9.10.09) NSW”, I agree with you about taking a stand and not entering, but unfortunately the RAS wouldn’t care, but at this point people have invested in too much time, money and energy not to follow through with not entering. Sydney 2009 saw our instructor asked to judge a large open section (we only show in breed sections so it didn’t affect us), a friend was also asked to judge who is employed by a well know exhibitor who had to withdraw from the relevant classes she had intended to compete in because of her employee judging (she was told before her entries went in though) and we copped a judge who we wouldn’t have paid $3.50 at an Ag show to go under. So, I’m asking (but not really wanting to go down this avenue but feeling forced to) does anyone out there have any legal connections or knows of any Legislative Acts regarding Businesses / Companies etc such as the RAS conducting competitions which takes entry money, pays prize money and acknowledges ABN’s but withholds vital information to prospective competitors giving them no choice but to take a chance and enter. I would like to think that some Legislative Act governing the running of competitions would expect that all relevant information would be provided before expecting anyone to proceed giving them an option to go ahead and compete or not to. Even if the RAS does give a refund on entries not accepted they withhold $11 from each entry. So what if you can’t compete because you are employed/employee/related or have business dealings etc. with the judge, do you get a full refund? Probably not, an illegal practice? Probably yes. I’m sure one of the current affairs shows would love to run with this story. All this frustration could be avoided with the release of a judges list. I can understand that maybe a few judges may not have been secured but I bet the majority of them have. So RAS, do the right thing, let people know where they stand and let them make their personal choice to enter or not. Name Withheld, NSW.

Hi Em,  Even though I ain't competing at the royal I had a sticky beak at it anyway at the schedual, and I was very suprised to find that again they did not release the judges list...Now for whatever reason they have not published it and I guess we can all speculate as to why...or even some people 'in the know' might know exactually as to why they haven't...But I think it is very unfair! Has the RAS seriously not had a year to get a list of judges? Isn't that what monthly meeting are all about? I mean even if they just gave a list of who has said 'yes they might judge' would even be better then no list, people then would be able to maybe 'take a chance' at it, rather then go 'I will be crossing my finger's arm's and leg's that this judge won't be judging'. ' Only having a steaky beak and a small one at that, I didn't see if there was a refund should someone not be able to compete. Now if they don't refund, that really is almost stealing!  Name Witheld NSW.

Hi Troubled, the Part Welsh and Part APSB/APSB-RP were on at the same time at Sydney this year, and there were lots of competitors experiencing the same problem of clashing classes. It was just lucky that the Part APSB/APSB-RP were in the main arena (as it is normally in the Schmit) and competitors could rush from class to class. Yet another aspect that Sydney needs to review, apart from taking people's money and keeping everyone in the dark about judge's names. -Fed Up, NSW

It is also a shame to see competitors judging the next day at another show, only to place their face book friends before other well deserving competitors, along with placing well known show names riding misbehaving horses above other horses that do perfect work outs.  Yes some show professionals have some very beautiful horses, but if the judge is not going to judge on the workout of the day and the horse takes off with the rider, why work them out, just call them in and put the ribbons straight on. Will Showing ever be judged on the workout of the day – not on who knows who, who is someone’s friend or just trying to keep in good with the professionals. Name withheld.

The sad thing about Sydney Royal not listing the judges names is that the people in the 'KNOW' will find out who is judging the section that they want to show in. If the list is printed by the RAS everyone has the same information, and can make their decision.  It is now too expensive to compete in a section if you know that you have no chance at winning or placing under that judge.  Untill Sydney selects their own judges, it would be great if they selected a number of top horse judges from overseas to judge the whole show, it would not then be up to committees to select the judges for sydney. Witheld NSW

Hi Emma - sorry but for $60.00 per class and they debit my card straight away, our family after much expense through the year qualifying as at this weekend we have stopped chasing points and are not going to enter. We are attending HOY this weekend, and then just going to a show if we want to. We just can't afford to enter 4 ponies with that amount of money and have the risk of loosing our money if we can't or dont want to compete under a certain person. Sorry but the RAS is turning people away now. Very Sad NSW

Hi Emma - I have just read through the timetable for 2010 Royal and have noticed that they have placed the Part APSB and the Part Welsh on the same day. With many ponies being registered in both these sections Im sure it will cause trouble for those competing more that the one pony! Do you know why they have done this? If you could pass on this feedback to the RAS I would appreciate it.  TROUBLED

I would like to share my recent disappointing tale with you. My 11 year old daughter competed all weekend at Taree show and earnt herself some well deserved prize money, only to find that towards the end of Sunday her ponies false tail had fallen out. We had announcements made over PA and checked with all officials but the tail had not been handed in. So I hope that the person who helped them self to it is happy with themselves, as my daughter now has to hand over her prize money to go towards the purchase of a replacement. After all our years of showing, we have always found everyone to be friendly and honest, this has been a real wake up call.  DISAPPOINTED - LAKE MACQUARIE.

Hi Emma,  In response to the complaint about a competitors bad behaviour, no offence to the writer intended, but a more appropriate place to complain about a competitor verbally abusing a judge or official would be to put a complain in writing to the SHC (assuming this offender is a member).  There are rules about competitor behaviour (see section 10 of the SHC competition rules regarding improper behaviour and disorderly conduct); if you feel that someone has breached these rules then you can submit a complaint in writing and have the SHC deal with it accordingly. Quite frankly, judges give up their time and effort to contribute to our sport and it really is becoming a thankless task.  The last thing they deserve is a mouthful of abuse.  Maybe if this particular competitor was pulled up about their behaviour then they might think twice before doing it again? Name Witheld NSW

Maybe the judges haven't been chosen yet, however it would be nice if the committee at least offered an explanation to say 'Judges names later or soon to be realised" or "Judges still be confirmd". Half the problem is they don't tell us anything, but are quick to take our money. The general public still come to watch us, they need us for the Grand parade photo moment, but all we ask is just common courtesy and ready communication. It doesn't cost the RAS to post something on any horse website letting us know their situation. By doing that it would stop all of us becoming angry and annoyed with them. Prepared to give the benefit of the doubt, to a certain extent I am.... John VIC

Hi Emma - Sydney Royal should be prepared to offer a "full" refund up to a certain date after the close of entries should a judge not suit, I will not pay $3.00 do go under a judge that won't like me or my horse letalone $60.00!! What happened to the system of the last few years when all we had to pay was a "nomination fee" that was forfeited if you didn't follow through with your entry..oh I remember, they did advertise the judges then!! What is the point of meeting with the different societies when they clearly are not prepared to come up with the goods. The RAS should be ashamed and seem to enjoy playing games with us horse people!!  Signed: Thinking long & hard NSW !!!!!

In regard to the judges list not being available for the 2010 royal, I have a friend who has been asked to judge and we were discussing this the other day and they told me they still had 2 weeks to decide and let the RAS know of their decision to judge or not to judge.  So technically the judges list for Sydney hasn’t even been finalised!!  So work it out, in 2 weeks they will have a preliminary list, then for those who are invited to judge and say ‘no thanks’ then there is the job of finding another judge for that spot and maybe giving them a couple of weeks to think about it??  So with 6 weeks left until closing of entries I think we all have to do our entries at the eleventh hour and maybe the RAS might release the judges names just prior to closing if we all take a deep breath and be ask very nicely?? Name withheld (nsw)

Hi Emma, After finding out that Sydney Royal is once again witholding judges names until after closing date I felt compelled to provide some feedback on the matter. After all the widespread negative press the RAS received last year for not releasing the judges names until after the closing date,I would have thought that they would have learned a lesson.....sadly it appears not the case! The RAS needs to understand that it takes a great deal of time,money and expense to get horses qualified (with many currently driving hundreds of miles to get wins required),and it is totally wrong in these financial times to force people to do the hard yards blindfolded. I can only summize this decision is based on greed by the RAS,and if this is not the case,I would like to see them refund all monies paid if a competitor decides they do not want to show once the judges list is released. Come on Sydney,lift your game,the other Royal Shows have no issues with it and either should you. Name Witheld

Hi Emma! I would like to make a comment on the topic of show societies not releasing the name of judges. I find it extremely annoying that the RAS do not let competitiors know who will be judging at Sydney Royal until the entries close. The entry fee has gone up for next year for a breed class to $60 per class plus a $20 processing fee. My horse has qualified for 2 classes so entries will be $140 plus fuel, bedding, stabling, feed, food for myself, accommodation and days off work. I am concerned that if i pay my upfront entry fees i will be up against a judge that i know does not like my horse. I show a palomino and because this is a coloured class the horses vary widley from quarter horses, arabian derivatives, stockhorses, warmbloods and ponies. I might get a judge who i know prefers a certain breed. Why go to all the expense? JM.

Dear ESH - Everyone needs to take a stand and refuse to enter (which we all know they wont care about) or inundate them with faxes, viewer feedback etc. It's not good enough they expect us to pay up front yet they wont provide names up front. Show your disgust and support other shows instead that support their competitors - Sydney doesn't. I sure bet they released showjumpers their course builder!!!! Top Hackie NSW

Hi Em, On the topic of Sydney Royal why do the RAS not list judges until after closing dates? Should competitors not have the right to decide whether they wish to compete under a specific person or not! What happens if your spend hundreds, if not thousands, on entries to find your mate is judging and therefore you are not eligible under the rules of showing to compete under them...do the RAS offer a full refund? What if the listed adjudicator is on a person's 'thanks, but no thanks list' list shouldn't we have the right to choose? Their decision to again not list judges until AFTER entries close takes away our right to choose...why do they seem to consistently make life hard for horse exhibitors! Just wishing to raise the question yet again?Anonymous, NSW

We waited in anticipation for the Sydney schedule to be released and we were very happy to see that the committee had considered some of the feedback given from your viewers such as an under 12.2hh child's pony.  It was obvious last year that due to its popularity, the childs pony class was too big.  By splitting it into 2 divisions it has made it fairer and more judgable.  The rules and schedule are clearer in most areas although this constant question mark over performance is still a bug bare to most of us.  We have gone above and beyond to gain extra performance this year so it will be interesting to see if our entries are accepted as per the criteria or if its still just a lottery. Natalie Cross NSW

Hi Em, Just reading the schedule for Sydney Royal  2010 and I see that there not including Arabians this year?? Why is that?? So it was a waste of time qualifying my Arabian for this event!! C.G.

Hi Emma - I was wondering if you could find out why there are no APSB Riding Pony colt classes, only fillies and geldings.  There are colt classes at all the shows, so I have qualies for this class, but no class. Could you find out why. Much appreciated. T.L.

I felt compelled to write to your viewer feedback regarding harassment and intimidation at a show recently. This person verbally attacks and harasses other competitors who are competing in the same height class as her.  This person comes down to do a run of shows in a certain area every year and dictates so called "rules" to other competitors. "Rules" which are not listed anywhere in the schedule.  May I ask - how does a win in childs, ladies or adults classify as an open win and therefore knocks you out of competing in the second ring if you didn't win your height class?? Surely these are "restricted" classes. This person then has other antics so when you get called in first in a class and this person gets called in fourth, they put themselves in the first position and tell you rudely that they aren't moving and to get stuffed. The judge intervened and told them to go into the position they were called in. It is just ridiculous!! The poor judge and committee members were subjected to verbal abuse by this person. Name Witheld.

Ha ha loved your comment! I have had the personal experience many years ago at Sydney Royal when the English judge that year decided to ride a couple of horses out of the Championship line up. I had been asked to ride a very difficult “unhappy horse”, which did not belong to me nor had been educated by me who took off with the judge,  any “old Hackies” will remember it.  I had warned her before she got on (maybe not appropriate but I felt a necessity). But by the second canter stride and the judges reins very long, away they went with the red coats in toe! It was funny after the fact BUT “bloomin heck” would have been the mildest thing she would have been thinking. But when you sit back watch, analyse and or judge and you see riders that feel the necessity to continually be banging the horses side every stride, shatteringly tight nosebands, grinding teeth, tortured tonges, over bitted to early,  mouths open, behind the vertical and on the forehand why the hell wouldn’t they be “unhappy”. Try and put the brake and the accelerator on at the same time in your car while you are driving next time and see what happens.The sad part is that these are feeling, thinking beings!!  Oh if only they could talk. Name withheld.

As far as Judges riding horses, there are a few Judges I wouldn't want to come near any of my horses, as we follow less is more mantra and I've seen the odd Judge almost 'challenge' the horse with strong and inappropriate aids. Then on the pro side, it's delightful (in a wicked sort of a way) to see Judges get on horses which are obviously ridden 'strongly' and have a "bloomin' heck' look come across their faces. I was privileged to see this once and I must admit I laughed, because this broad sash winning  hack (other than enduring the tortures of winter rugging in summer heat-prosecutable offence in my opinion) had been trained under saddle with fixed, pulled in side reins (whilst being ridden) and being asked to bring herself up and into the bridle, the poor thing. (Still, some of those unhappy horses do pull some ribbons in, don't they?!) Name Witheld

The 'Set up' shows response 1/10/09, well that has being going for as long as I can remember, unethical corruption in the horse world, shock, horror!!! Actually, it probably equally indicates the morals of both competitor and judges who participate in this. I tend to avoid showing under somebody we know because I assume they are going to be more critical of the performance just to make sure favouritism isn't shown and I also wouldn't want to put somebody in that dilemma in the first place. The thing is, you either meet the salt of the earth people, who go out their way to help and encourage you, who are friendly and down to earth. Like the strangers at shows who  have helped us plait up, lent us scissors, caught an errant horse etc etc that actually turn around to your child  and say a nice encouraging word or even congratulate your child (whom is told make sure you say congratulations regardless on winning, placing or not!)on their win over them, random acts of kindness that warm your heart!    Or... you get the complete opposite.  The amount of backstabbing, meaness and lying is unfortunately part and parcel of the horse world too.  I remember an advert which asked for help catching whoever hacked off a pony's forelock; mane and tail! How low can you go?!!! I can only assume the pony's owner was doing well thus earning the jealousy of another! I also  went to a trainer/competitor's stable complex and keeping in mind I did not know this person very well, this individual went onto to badmouth people who were supposedly friends only the second time I met this person  (friends were fellow competitors, say no more!!).The warning bells should have alarmed then, but nooooooo, silly me, I ended up being 'caught' with this person too. (BTW, if one intends to charge a daily rate of training, one should have an impeccable memory, lest get caught out invoicing for training days whilst being away at the same time frame competing at a major show!). Anyway the horse showing thing drives me absolutely nuts at times, especially the open corruption, the lack of manners (is 'well done' really sooooooooo hard to say?!)   yet like a moth to the flame.... Name Witheld NSW

Hi Emma, I'm glad we are not the only ones how see this happen. Believe you have a connection with a judge, you should do the right thing and compete somewhere else or refrain from that show. Don't go and put yourself in any situation that leaves a question mark on the award your horse has won. It's not the horses fault to be named champion 3 weeks in a row all because you knew the judge and knew you were going to win. Everyone will then read in results or see that the only reason you one x y and z was because of this or that. Let the horse achieve the bows fairly. Name Witheld NSW

Hi there, actually I have to agree with one of your viewers about perhaps not unsaddling horses for the GN, It just takes forever and I understand why the English judges may want to do it, but here in Australia is uncommon practice and we don't really need to do it. Some horses are made saddle horses to perhaps hide any faults they may have as a led horse and as successful as they are under saddle, thats a saddle class, not led. Tom WA

Hey Em, Just responding to the comment by Name Withheld VIC, regarding their comment that the stripping section of Grand National should be scrapped as it is 'judged as an under saddle and performance class not led'.  Since when was led not an element of this class?  I've always known Grand National to include a component where some of the horses are stripped and that this is one of the elements are considered when selecting the winner and runner up.  I don't think it's too unreasonable, when you get down to your top five or so horses in a national competition to then have a really good look at their confirmation to determine which will be the ultimate winner (they have probably all worked well, and given a decent ride).  It actually isn't that uncommon for judges to be undecided between a couple of horses prior to this stage of the competition, and it's not uncommon for them to change there minds after seeing them with their saddles off.  Keep it in, I say.  Name Witheld NSW

Dear ESH, I have just read with interest the supportive comments that Grand National entrants, under saddle, should be stripped and shown as Led. If I wanted my horse to be shown a Led ! I would enter him as such. I do enter as saddle horse, not led ! I fail to understand the need for any Grand National Judge, presumable being appointed for their saddle qualifications, to wish to see the horse as Led. That defies the Class, being a horse under saddle!! If the judge cannot decide his preference without seeing the horse as Led, then the organiser have got the wrong judge.I have no objection to any “Judge” electing to try the horses out by riding each contestant as this would be within the “Under Saddle” requirements but, come on, to have difficulty in deciding one from the other and so require a strip, and hence by that, a Led Class, come on, sack the judge as incompetent to judge a saddle class.Saddle horses for saddle classes and Led horses for led classes. Not a cop out as both. Name Witheld, Vic.

A different point, I dont mind a judge seeing my horse without a saddle, however I question the legality of judges hoping on horses they don't know, in an environment that is out of the norm, what happens if they come off? Normally when someone has to ride your horse for the first time, you have the opportunity to discuss with them (leg here, sit there, talk to him) etc. I understand mostly when horses get to that level they are well equipment with many rider changes however in this case you are not allowed to speak to the judge to offer any tips. If the judge had something happen - who would be at fault. God forbid we never have this happen, however in today's world, it's perhaps something that should be printed in the entries from the SHC so competitors have peace of mind. Other than that I love the idea of music, I can see so far most people are so it would be lovely to see the wonderful committee take this onboard as a consideration. Thank you. Name Witheld NSW

Dear ESH, this is the first time I have submitted a topic for your feedback, out of frustration you can call it. We have just returned home from a large competition, to which we were advised that even prior to collecting our numbers and stable allocation, that everyone knew already how the winners were to be in our events and that bascially we were fighting for the minor ribbons. How can this be? How can a show so widely attended and pre-enter be so set up. Why do as mere mortals bother even travelling hours to attend. Shouldn't it be judged on the day? It's just not fair. I have seen it time and time again that people go to Ag shows and no full well they will win as they are friends with the judges, but this set up of shows needs to stop. It's ruining the sport but no-one seems to care or want to do anything about it. Very Frustrated, VIC

I hope that many agree with me here, however I would like the SHC to abandon the idea of unsaddling hroses at the Grand National. It's judged as an under saddle and performance class not led, and you can clearly see those horses that are not used to being led like that. Plus it takes so much longer for the classes and is very drawn out for those watching. There's really no need, if the judge can't decide after seeing workouts and riding themselves, I don't a led part of the class would make a difference. Name Witheld VIC.

I feel that the SHC should introduce an In-Hand Championship for All Breeds of horses that have won a Royal Show Championship in their respective Breeds as it seems that most years, the SHC bring out judges with a wide range of expertise so I feel that this would only add to the prestige of the show and the judges would more than likely be qualified to judge many different breeds. They could for example hold an under 14hnd championship and an over 14hnds championship. There is an event similar held at Wembley and is very pretigious and to win a "ticket" to compete is something to strive for.....To get it off the ground, an idea would be to have 2 years qualifying period in the first year that the event is held..food for thought SHC Committee? Name Witheld

Dear ESH, we are not qualified next year sadly however I would love to one day ride there and ride to some funky music instead of just light tones which don't create much atmosphere. Many Arabian shows do that and dressage and I think whoever thought of the idea, it's a great one. Jan QLD

I like the idea of music, there used to be a class at EFA HOY which you could choose your music to ride to for an extra class fee etc. I can't think of too many people that would object and it would add a bit more excitment and pizzaze for competitons. A. O QLD

The ASC recommends to all NSW agricultural shows and they are told that SHC members are bound by SHC Competition Rules
regarding eligibility to compete under Judges.  It is also pointed out to them that in this day and age with the costs involved in showing that it is
unreasonable to expect competitors to travel hours in some cases and then find that they are unable to compete under that Judge.
I will bring it up at the ASC meenting in December and again at the Annual Conference at Easter.   If people let me know which shows won't release names, I will speak to the Delegates from the Group they belong to so they are aware. Helen Kirton

Dear ESH - what a terrific idea about choosing music, I have competed there for 4 years straight now and I really do think this will liven up the atmosphere and give competitors are little extra excitment to their workouts. I would be happy to pay an additional fee if that was the case, although I don't think I would be choosing anything Michael Jackson as for a while I have I have heard all this songs to death! I also think Rider Champions should be given a garland and rug also. The kids see the Hacks etc all receive big prizes yet all they get are rosettes for the some status of award.  Hackie VIC

Bring on the Music please!! Love that suggestion. Name Witheld NSW.

Dear Stunned showie,  I agree with you wanting to know who the judges were at a recent event. But would like to reply to your comment, “Does anyone know if the SHC has a rule (or could develop a rule) that every show society has to release the judge’s names and rings they are judging? Of course, the majority of show societies are very obliging and more than helpful with Information”.  The SHC can make any rules they like but are not binding on any other society.  As I am led to believe the SHC only has jurisdiction on shows that are run under SHC rules and should not have any say as to how other societies run their shows as it would be like the Arabian Society telling the Welsh what to do, why should the SHC be the be all and end all of the showing world, they are just another association like any other, I don’t agree that they should be given the right to tell every show society what to do as per your quote.  Other breed societies have their own rules and by laws.  Also the Agricultural shows are run under the Agricultural Societies of NSW for that state etc and are run under Agricultural Societies Rules, with Sydney Royal being the Final for the Agricultural shows in NSW, hence you having to have the majority of your performances from Ag shows. This is not to bash the SHC, as I think they do a wonderful job, however I am against one society getting so big that they dictate what can and can not happen in the showing world.  If this was to happen it would only breed more nepotism in a world where it is already rife. HACKIE, NSW

Sydney Royal springs to mind of being guilty of this one. & recently too. I’m not sure what the point if it is either. Knowing who is judging is the deciding factor on whether we go & compete stay at home & not waste our time either because we know the judge or know that our horses will not be competitive. Why all this secret squirrel business is beyond me to. Sharyn NSW

I disagree that GN qualifiers are only political. I currently have more than one horse qualified for nationals or GN and I struggle to remember the judges names, let alone be close enough to slip her a $50.  Name Withheld, WA

I would like to suggest that competitors perhap be allowed to choose their own music to compete to. Maybe charge an extra $5.00 perhaps for the SHC but allow us to submit a tune for the 2 - 2.5 minutes allowed for workouts. I really feel that this could liven up the show and bring some entertainment back to the horses and have competitors show their horses off in the best way and to a catchy song suited to the horse. Jo VIC

Gee Jo WA, how interesting that you are willing to "sit it out" once qualified for Royal and HOY, but not GN. Why is there a difference? And yes we ALL spend thousands on our ponies/horses and love to show, and just remember there is a Top 10, which means there are other nice quality animals there, and it is as we know judges opinion on the day. Once you get to the Grand Nationals it would be lovely to see a larger array of quality animals, but it all comes back to sportsmanship and teamwork! Also Jodee WA, why would we want to compete against the "best in Australia," well that could be because maybe the view of International Judges may be different from Australian judges, which does seem to happen. It will be interesting  for the 2010, won't it!    Name Witheld WA

Hi Emma It seems pretty clear to me, that there is so much confusion about what should be, and what is, as far as GN qualifiers and what is correct (eg is it State by State qualifying) or is it open slather on anyone from any State able qualify, in ANY State.I think SHC Australasia needs to respond and indeed review, if necessary, to set us ALL straight as to what is required. If it is State be State, we need to cater for those qualifiers before next year, if it is open slather on anyone qualifying, well so be it!   Come on SHC Australasia, give us guidance, instead of  not entering the discussion. Name witheld

Recently, I called the secretary of a show society to ask the judges names for their upcoming show (as I always do). My question was answered with "I don't know who the judges are", so I politely replied with, "That's ok, could you please direct me to someone who may know", to be blown away by "we don't want anyone to know who the judges are before they arrive at the show"!!! I kindly asked "so you do know who the judges are?", blunt reply- "I can't tell you!!!". I politely explained to the secretary that competitors must know who the judges are in case there is a conflict of interest, i.e. business dealings etc in accordance with the SHC rules. And if a competitor drove 4 hours to a show without knowing the judges names, and found out they were ineligible to compete under SHC rules, what a waste of time and money this would be! But no! They wouldn't have a bar of it! Does anyone know if the SHC has a rule (or could develop a rule) that every show society has to release the judges names and rings they are judging? Of course, the majority of show societies are very obliging and more than helpful with information. Thanks! -Stunned Showie, NSW

Gee Jo WA, how interesting that you are willing to "sit it out" once qualified for Royal and HOY, but not GN. Why is there a difference? And yes we ALL spend thousands on our ponies/horses and love to show, and just remember there is a Top 10, which means there are other nice quality animals there, and it is as we know judges opinion on the day. Once you get to the Grand Nationals it would be lovely to see a larger array of quality animals, but it all comes back to sportsmanship and teamwork! Also Jodee WA, why would we want to compete against the "best in Australia," well that could be because maybe the view of International Judges may be different from Australian judges, which does seem to happen. It will be interesting  for the 2010, won't it!    Name Witheld WA

Can someone let me know when the GN's became a "State" representing show?  If you want to represent your state qualify your horses for the Nationals at Werribee in Dec.  The GN as far as I'm aware and correct me if I'm wrong was/is not a "State" representation, just the best horses/riders from around Australia, qualifying at the best shows from around Australia.  WA viewer commented they have only 4 qualifying shows.... Up until this year NT had one which was the Darwin Royal.  We now have the SHC HOTY which was run for the first time this year.  Yes my horse competed at both and qualified for the GN at both, and I had to travel 3000km (1500km each way).  If your horse isn't winning or qualifying then obviously doesn't deserve to be amongst the best in Australia.  At least in the bigger states you have shows regularly and can compete, be thankful! Cindy NT

"If you cant beat the best horses in your state why would you want to show against the best in the country? Jodee WA" The funny thing about GN's is its not political so it doesnt matter what your name is, what  horse/pony you ride, if you pull off an amazing workout you have a good a chance as anyone. I for one would not hesitate to go to GN's again as what I experienced was a very fair show and the one that won deserved too , Name Witheld WA

The Australian Hunter Horse Association Inc (www.hunterhorses.com.au) writes a submission to each Royal Show in each state following the completion of the event detailing the feedback of its members and the general horse community on any show or working hunter classes held at the Royal Show. The AHHA is currently gathering information for its submission to Royal Adelaide Show and is seeking feedback from those who attended. Please limit your feedback only to Hunter Classes held at the 2009 show. Please email your comments to: info@hunterhorses.com.au. Please note that constructive criticism is preferred and any slanderous comments will be ignored. Lisa Le Provost

On behalf of the Murrumburrah - Harden Show Horse Section I would like to thank all competitors for their attendance at this years show.  This was the first year of the greatly increased horse schedule which included a second day of classes.  We received great weather for the 2 days and excellent attendance across all classes.  A few alterations will be made to the schedule for next year in regards to the timing of classes.  If anyone has any requests for classes for next year if they could contact me on nordicpark@netspace.net.au .  I would also like to thank the judges for their time and effort in judging during the show.  We look forward to another successful TWO day show next year. Bec Medhurst

Yes Chrissy I do see your view with regard to competitors from other states competing at Royal Shows other than in their own State (WA), and yes no-one would want to travel over here (WA) as an extra (at about $16000 for us for the GN when talking about the cost, and that is ONLY to do GN, not the Sydney Royal and not to just compete here for the rest of the year) , I get that, then to me there would need to be qualifying STATE classes only. To me that would seem fair!  I know you all have the luxury of being able to travel between each state easily and if anything I am so envious as I love to compete also, but I do believe that to qualify to represent your state, you need to reside in THAT state to be eligible, therefore state qualifying classes. I don't want to stop anyone from competing at ANY Royal Show, as it is elite, but they should qualify FOR the State in which they reside, in their State!By all means have RAS events that are for all, in all ROYAL Shows, but the other GN qualifiers should be by State only! My views only!  Name Witheld WA

If you cant beat the best horses in your state why would you want to show against the best in the country? Jodee WA

In WA we have 4 Grand National Qualifiers and obviously 1 National Qualifier.  I find it quite odd that there is all this talk of people sitting GN qualifiers out so that others have a shot at qualifying… Grand Nationals is the elite show – where the best of the best get to attend, it’s what we strive for.  If you aren’t able to qualify really should you be there????  Where’s the satisfaction in qualifying if you’re not competing against all the horses out there because they’ve been forced to sit out???? If the same horse qualifies over and over again isn’t that telling you something???  Over the many many years that I’ve been involved in showing every year there are different horses and people going to GN’s, of course there are some that will go several times – good on them.   Do we want to turn GN’s into just another gymkanna??? How will the sport continue to grow with people striving to be better if we make it easy for everyone to qualify?  To be honest we only have 5 really big shows here with really no opportunity to travel instate to other royals etc, I love showing my horses and those 5 big shows are what we work towards so I for one will continue to attend them.  I pay thousand and thousands a year to have show horses not to mention the work that we put in to have them at their best, of course, want to show them off at the big events.  In saying that once they are qualified for royals & HOTY’s I do sit them out so others can qualify to attend.  I think we need to toughen up!!!! We have different judges at all 5 of our big shows – if they are picking the same horses then I don’t think we can whinge and moan that it’s not fair. Instead of finding ways to make it easier to qualify maybe we need to look on how we can improve as individuals so that we are more competitive at these events. Thanks Emma, Jo - WA

Its a fine line with how well one can know the judge, so the 3 month ruling could apply as a guideline.  Its not a hard written rule but if you have had something to do with a judge within that time you should really give it some thought as some one else may have seen you having that coffee at the back of your float with that judge a month ago. I love showing and the horses and the people I meet as well, but I wish there were more people like G from NSW 18/9/09 as they can come up and say Hello to me too.  I have also shown for thirty years and I can honestly say that as soon as I arrive I don't get heaps of social calls to my truck, I see the same groups of faces every week they know my horse they know my name but have never said Hello to me once and if they actually did they would probably be surprised as I would give them a pleasant response. I can also say that in all the years I have done showing there is no way that I know just about everyone as over the years I have seen many come and go including the judges, and I can always find a judge to show under that I have never met, or have only ever said Hello to once or twice and that was it. There is nothing wrong with saying hello to as many people as you can as being socially polite is one thing, but having a social get together around a campfire, discussing horses then showing under them 2 weeks later is another, but if you haven't spoken to them in over 3 months then its a different situation as whatever horse related stuff you talked about before is not as fresh in everyones minds so the influence is not as strong. J.D. NSW

This is a very interesting topic, everyone has full right to show there horses/ponies at any show provided they stick to the rules and regulations that go along with it. People who show every single weekend, I honestly don't know how they do it...well I can understand if they need performances, but not when they already have a performance, I really think horses/ponies do need to have a break from shows, and allow the horses/ponies to have some down time, now not by spelling, but doing something completely different, now "bush bashing" comes to my mind, or even a trail ride somewhere the horse/pony has never been before, while on trail you can still train, but in a different way, it gives the horse/pony a different sort of scenery! I can completely understand why people don't want to take them out, because either, they don't want them to 'act up', scratch tack and/or horse/pony, but If i was a horse/pony, and was only ever taken to shows, and trained at home in the arena, then being spelled through winter, I would go 'nuts'...simply because of boredom! for me showing is fun, because I love being able to dress me and my pony up, come home with a ribbion (hopefully), but, also I love being able to the next time I ride, ride around town, and ride through the paddocks. That is what I want my pony to do, go showing one weekend, the next ride around town with friends (and even tying the horses up to trees or a fence and going and getting hot chips! (yum)), and maybe even play around while on the horses/ponies by swaping around and riding each others horses/ponies, maybe the odd race here and there, and maybe even play a few other games to. Name withheld

Seems to me some people only read half a a viewers post  then get off on their high horse rant and rave  before ever finishing reading the rest of the post.  I don’t think anyone is saying the Winner was not a worthy winner of the said class as it read as he is a beautiful horse /rider combination well worth all his many wins   I believe what people are   saying is that the recently added ridden classes on Thoroughbred show day at Brisbane Royal  should be for thoroughbreds full stop not .   horses showing T/bred qualities they have all hacking classes plus their registered breed classes as well  For example our riding pony ridden classes don’t say  showing riding pony qualities or our ASH  don’t say showing Stockhorse qualities or any other  breed so why should these new classes be different they should be as per other breeds and be only for  T/breds  sponsors are there to see and support Thoroughbreds so show them Led & Ridden like other breeds If they want to add more classes showing T/bred qualities then put them on at another time Name withheld NSW

I have given thought to how the SHC council would be able to organize their qualifications for the Grand Nationals having read some viewer feedback on your site. I am not on and do not partake in the organizing of any shows, however I am baffled as to how the SHC would be able to devise a plan that would help other horses qualify for their big show with the way some shows are run, as I have been in a similar position – so close yet so far away from qualifying for the grand nationals. The only way I can see, is if the royal shows changed their championship format into an actual ‘placing class’, as in 1st, 2nd, 3rd and so on. That way you could work down the line until you have a horse that has not qualified before. At most SHC shows where there is a top 10 involved it could work giving 1st, 2nd, 3rd etc place, but how would the competitors like the royal shows run?  That in itself (getting royal shows to change their championship format) would not be an easy task! Also trying to encourage the Royal shows to put on more classes such as a small and big Galloway, and small and big Hack class, would not be an easy task. As you might find that qualifying for the Grand Nationals may only become harder, as events such as the royal shows, are unable to cater for such qualification criteria.

Also I noticed in one person’s feedback from WA, I read from their feedback, that a SHC affiliated show and Royal show should only be open to competitors that reside in the state of where the show is held, in WA I can understand how you have such an opinion as not many interstate competitors travel to Perth Royal to compete. Drawing from my own experience, competitors from just about every state come to compete at the royal shows, if you look at this years Canberra, Sydney, Brisbane and Adelaide Royal Results you will see that a majority of the championship horses come from outside the Royal Show state. At the SHC events in NSW, aside from NSW SHC state show, an interstate competitor is more then welcome to compete in the classes (as far as I know, as I have competed at interstate SHC events in both Qld and Vic!). Are you saying that they should not allow interstate competitors? If that is the case, and the Royal shows don’t change their class structure, NSW competitors would lose 3 qualifying shows, Qld and Vic would lose 2 qualifying shows and WA would have 1 less, which makes it very difficult to qualify. Moreover, if you bought your horse all the way over from WA to compete at the Grand Nationals, with Sydney Royal a week later I am sure you would want to make the most of your opportunity and journey, and enter in Sydney Royal, however, from what you are suggesting, interstate competitors would not be eligible to compete. Now if you were in that position, I am sure you would be disheartened by not being able to compete.

In my own opinion, when people are asking for something to be changed or are unhappy with the ways shows are run, I think you need to show ‘HOW’ they can be changed, rather then just complain about it. It isn’t that I disagree with you, I see you point and totally agree that sometimes it isn’t fair, it is just that there is not a truly feasible way to change everything!  Could the competitors whom are unhappy about this topic, please share how you think the classes should be run? When you do I will also forward a letter to SHC, but I don’t think its fair to complain to them when you can’t offer a solution to the problem. Chrissy, NSW

Hi Emma, it's very disheartening to be plaiting up your horse the night before, knowing such and such is going and apparently have the win set up for them. Then you go and oh surprise you get second to them. I like the person's idea of naming all the judges in the results. I know you may do it from a sherr reporting level when you team goes to a show, but I do like to see which judges have placed which horses, it also is great to show as if you know a judge has given a horse a champion and they are in your class, if they judge again you may go somewhere else instead perhaps. So I like that idea on your website. Maybe everyone who sends results from shows and can the judges also. Nevertheless, I'm going out again this weekend so chance my luck with my galloway and see who is greatful for a win or just expect it. C.J NSW

I have a response to the showing and performance feedback posted today: I agree with the nsw post about being able to enjoy showing for what it is. Preparing horses and ponies for shows is extremely costly and time consuming and we should be able to enjoy everything that we want to do with them. I have also heard the comment plenty of times of "just do enough to qualify and then leave them at home" or "why is he out again arent you qualified already". I also have the end goal of qualifying for sydney but i also love taking my ponies out to shows and having fun with them whether we win or lose, so i too will keep taking them out. Every result comes down to judges choice anyway so everyone has their good and bad days at shows so we should just all enjoy it for what it is, a chance to show off our gorgeous horses and have fun and meet people. NSW

In response to the viewers comment on performances at shows, I agree that we all still have the right to attend the ag shows we chose even if we have our performances however out of respect for my fellow competitors I have decided that I will just compete in the ladies/adults hack rather than my height class once I have my performances so that others have a fair chance of being able to get the performances they need.  There are a lot of comments on the Viewer Feedback about the lack of fairness in our sport and I can entirely agree with some of these comments in relation to a number of judges and their lack of objectiveness.  Therefore I would like to see us improve the sportsmanship at our shows and I think by staying out of my height class this is one way of helping others, while still being able to compete and enjoy my horse and the outing.  Afterall it is meant to be an enjoyable and friendly experience competing at shows and you aren’t going to foster any friends by going around and around and ending up with way too many performances to the detriment of others.  Let’s be fair about it! Name Withheld, NSW

I dont show my horses just to qualify for a royal, but after I am qualified I think that my horses deserve a bit of a break as they are horses not machines and I would prefer to go to a royal with a happy horse who aside from showing gets deserved time off before getting ready for the big shows, rather than one who has become sour from going out every single weekend. Yes it costs thousands of dollars to show a horse so once qualified, unless you have a bottomless pit of money why continue to spend?  So for me its not about getting my 8 wins and that's it, some of us have other interests as well and would like to get their horses qualified early so they dont have to keep missing out on other things, those with non horsey family and friends could relate to this. Each to their own by all means once qualified keep showing if that's your whole life and you dont have anything else to do, but for those who dont continue once qualified, the positive side is at least they are giving other horses a chance. Name Witheld NSW

To Name Witheld NSW - Re Qualifying GN and Showing On - Yes you are exactly what we speak of! We have only a few qualifiers in our State (4 to be exact) and your views are exactly what I speak of. You continue to get out there and keep everybody else out of the GN. How lucky are you? But do you know that if they are the only shows you have to go to, god I feel sorry for you. Over here there are Champion Days, Agy Shows, Royal Show and HOY's (2) but no you need to qualify and keep qualifying to keep everybody else from doing so. You go bud, and if you can't think outside the square of sportmanship and teamwork, I do feel sooo sorry for you! Some of us are team players! Name Witheld WA

I love showing, I love the beautiful horses, I love to try and win, and I love to socialise and make friends with as many like-minded people as I can.  When I go to a show I don't hide in my truck and only appear for my classes, neither does anyone else I know.  I get out and say "Hello, how are you" to as many people as I can!  If I then show under one of these people that I have spoken to, Name Witheld from QLD (15/9/09) wants to call me corrupt!  We have shown horses for over thirty years, we know nearly everyone - how are we meant to show if we can't be judged by people we know?  There are rules that stop us from showing under judges that we have certain ties to and we abide by these rules, but please don't suggest that we can't show under someone just because we happened to share a joke two weeks ago, or parked next to each other at a show in woop woop, or camped at the same showground and sat round the same camp fire on a run out west!!  I am not corrupt, but I'm not a snob either, I will continue to be friendly and polite and say hello to other show-goers even if they are judges.  G. NSW

After breeding mini Horses sometime ago I recently attended a show as a onlooker and I was amused with the number of Mini’s that were not clipped.  Could someone please verify the regulations of showing a mini horse.  Have they changed, If so what are they. Name Witheld NSW

Is showing our horses only just about qualifying for a royal?  Don’t get me wrong, I too count those wins, and breathe a sigh of relief when I get them.  Recently I have attended many ag shows where the emphasis is on ‘qualifing”.  I have been lucky enough to qualify, but still continue to show.  I asked where a particular horse was on the weekend, to be told “he’s already qualified, so why would I bring him out?”.  Are we only supposed to attend shows until qualified for  a royal, then put them back in the paddock?  It costs thousands of dollars to own these animals, why not continue to show?  If my horse is qualified now, what do I do until the royals?  I will continue to show my horse. I believe I have that right. It has taken me thousands of dollars and who knows how many painful, sometimes tearful, hours of cleaning, training and preparing. I am not about to attend shows to get my 8 wins, and that’s it. Wondering how others view this topic? Name withheld, NSW

I totally agree with comments regarding the same competitors over and over  again qualifying for HOTY . Its a dying sport and until fairness becomes the main objective in the future it will cease to exist , I dont understand why competitors wouldn't want some of ther fellow statesmen competeing alongside them (if they actually attend) , come on SHC give the rest a chance, and just for the record I have qualified and I did attend GN's. Name Witheld WA

Harden show was well attended and the organisers should be pleased with the amount of interest in the show.I hope that they will repeat the horse programme again. Name witheld NSW

While on the topic of corruption, it amazes me to have our horse a proven royal show winner being supreme hack of the show one week, then in round and out in an open class the next week, while novice and obviously still green horses are left in the line up with names on board. I have NEVER seen this happen to a big name competitor. All I could say to everyone in the camp was the main thing is that WE know our horse looked a million dollars and worked well and that's all that matter at this point.  The worst that has happened is that we missed out on a performance and have to wait longer to gain all our performances before we can have a well earned rest so no hard feelings to the judge and we leave it at that and move on.   Thanks to all the judges up here who have chosen our horses against the big names because of their own quality/presentation on the day and not who was riding/handling them.
Corruption does not always come from the judges either, if you know a judge on a 'Hello, How are you basis', then you shouldn't be taking them by surprise by entering the ring and putting that judge in a difficult situation.  If the judge then chooses that competitor for not wanting to compromise the friendship they also run the risk of appearing corrupt when that wasn't their intention.  So to all the competitors who don't go before a judge they know, have peace of mind knowing you have nothing to do with corruption in showing.  Name Witheld QLD

What people seem to misunderstand is that being a committee member is not a profession, it is completely voluntary.  These volunteers also have jobs, children and other daily responsibilities to attend to, along with attempting to run a show.  Give them a break, as they are doing their best!  Instead of criticizing, try approaching the committee or better yet nominate and have a go yourself, you may find it a little harder on the other side of the fence.

The addition of a second day to the show, run as a full breeds program the day prior to public show day, worked really well. With many people out on an 'Western Run' at present, numbers were strong across most breeds. Hopefully the organisers will stay with the two day program in future years.

Well done to Leah Walsh and Helen Kirton for a really well run and friendly show this past weekend. There was a fantastic number of entries especially for ponies and galloways and the breeds. It's always a nice atmosphere and the judges were extremely pleasant to everyone. We got a performance and will always support that Ag Show, who gives back to competitors and no gate charges. Well done to everyone. Joanne

I refer to Disappointed Again and this person's request that the SHC Australasia review their qualifying schedule for the Grand Nationals. I totally agree with this request and have done so for the last few years!!!  It appears that even over here in WA, people who qualify early are more than happy to let the ones "tapping on the door" keep tapping on the door, and not get the chance to qualify by winning qualifier after qualifier (and WE have only 4), so that no-one else gets to go. Some of these winners/runner ups don't even attend the GN with their horse which makes it ALL the more frustrating for us who would dearly love to, and are prepared to go, but must wait patiently for these others to retire, sell, whatever. I would have thought encouraging each State to get a number of their good ones across to compete would have made it as exciting as this years GN, with so many wonderful horses there due to the EI restrictions cancelling the previous year. What a sight to behold with so much beautiful horse flesh! Now that is a true State by State representation.
This year I was told in March that a horse had been sold East, but was staying here to compete in our Newcomer events SHC and EWA first, which it did. It also won our first and second SHC GN qualifier and then low and behold it appears at the EWA National qualifier the HOY as well to qualify for the Nationals. Hmmm was that not sold East in March???? Now we have only Perth Royal and SHC HOY over here to qualify. The "sold horse" now competes GN anyway, having qualified in Perth but not owned by WA owners. Isn't it supposed to be representatives from their respective States, or once again is it just open slather on winning? I think greed has taken over and honesty has been lost. How very sad and predicatble in a sport where sportsmanship is dying quickly, and to our detriment.  Come on SHC, take an interest in what's going on out there and show some integrity with how this should be managed! At least give the third horse (or second runner up as EWA call it) the chance that if the winner or runner up aren't prepared to go, the second runner up has the offer. Let's face it, for all of these qualifiers, all your best horses are out, and there ARE more than just winner and runner up in each class out there tha have a lot of quality. Or in turn amend your qualifying rules so that once qualified in qualifiers other than the Royals and HOYS, you are unable to compete (sorry professional riders, I know yourselves and owners won't like my opinions and I do understand your plight, but I do stand by them). Both Royals and HOYS are very prestigiuos events and should be open to ALL, but these are also only my opinions.   Name witheld  WA

Hi Emma, Just wondering if you could help me with some of the showhorse council rules regarding judges and competitors please. My friend attended a show recently and travelled several hours only to be beaten by a horse in the open hack ring, of which the young lady judge had ridden at a Grand National Qualifier a couple of months prior. Now I know it was only a regular show but it still was a performance that someone esle could have had. What is the current ruling on this situation and where does the blame lie, the showhorse council judge or the competitor? Also what is the ruling for when a competitor trains/rides for( or gives lessons to) a judge that is judging in another ring. If the competitor trains and or rides for a person that is judging, can they compete in another ring on that day? If they can, than what happens when it comes to supreme? Does the judge or the competitor stand down? As I do not have a copy of the current showhorse rules, can anyone please help me with this information. cheers Curious Showy.

Hi Emma, I havnt read your site for a while and am surprised at some of the stupid ridiculous comments that people make about nothing more than what I can gather is jealousy over being beaten. We must all take a good long hard look at ourselves and realise that we spend $100's & $1000's even ,on the chance of winning a one inch piece of blue felt, which, in turn, once 6 are accumulated, the chance to spend another $1000 for the chance to win a 3 inch piece of blue felt. As for the winner of the TB Qualities Hack at the Ekka, I do not even know the people nor have never met the people who own the horse but in my opinion he is a truly beautiful animal. He is more of a TB type then any of mine and they have all won multiple races before becoming show hacks. I was stabled next to this horse many years ago whilst he was owned by a previous person, at Sydney Royal. He won then and I believe has won there since then. If it had not been pointed out to me in some Ekka photos captions that the horse was in fact a Stockhorse, then I would never have known any different. After all, the Australian Stockhorses originally were type classified and where from many other different breeds, some including the Thoroughbred and even the first welsh ponies that came over on the boats. These people were not the only non registered TB to compete and do well. Another current young superstar from Qld of whom is making a name for himself and might I say also, a magnificant animal, Is in fact a warmblood. All I have to say is if you dont like being beaten, then dont show!! LHB NSW

I would like to comment on the recent discussion regarding the horse that won the Thoroughbred Qualities class at Brisbane Royal.  The horse indeed is a stock horse, and as a very close friend of the breeder of this horse I can vouch to his thoroughbred qualities and that of his Dam.  Many of the Broodmares are of a Thoroughbred type, with the stud breeding quiet Children’s Hacks.  We are currently showing a Hack that is owned by the breeder and closely related to Highbury also.  It too has won many classes in the Hack Showing Thoroughbred Qualities.   To those that are jealous of Highbury’s performance year after year, get over it and just admire him for the great horse he is.  He has been awarded these wins under many judges and the horse is simply exquisite! The Stock Horse has a wonderful temperament and the ASH motto is “The Steed for Every Need”. Hackie NSW.

What does it take to win these days? We recently went to a country Ag show where the rings appeared to be so set up for friends to win it was ridiculous. Do the judges not realise that their reputations are on the line when a crowd full of people can clearly see what is going on?! I really do like the idea here where in some of the shows listed, the judges names are also listed, perhaps making them think that when everyone sees the results they will also she who it was the judged the show, perhaps then more people can see how set up the shows can be at times. You see friends who you see going to a show together one week or riding each others horse the week before , then playing the innocent card acting professional trying not to smirk when the judge is explaining a workout, then getting the blue ribbon, then talking to each other on the way out! It's just wrong. On the flip side you have some people clearly stating their can't compete at some shows because they may have some form of connection - that's the right thing to do! It's not a win if you've paid for it! I'm a very frustrated competitor as it's just happening week after week. Thanks Honest Showie NSW

Well I've seen some interesting things this weekend at the shows; one judge took almost an hour and a half to do 6 led classes (and then didn't finish their ring until 5:30), whilst another judge ate an icecream when judging a Championship class (very disrespectful)! Has anyone else seen any crazy shenanigans? Name Witheld NSW

I would like to point out that any breed pony should be able to compete on a level playing field in an "Open Pony" class. In the U.K, Mountain and
Moorland breeds will often appear in an 'open' pony class. It is a different matter if  it is a pony 'hack' class as obviously that is different to 'open' which should be open to all ponies regardless of breed, bone, type. We were at a show recently where the programme stated hunter ponies could compete in the open ring and vice versa. We won the 'open' pony class and the hunter class under the same judge! Also, to name withheld, there is place for some finer boned horses in the hunter classes, but unfortunately most hunter classes here are not weighted as they are overseas. Our pony might go better in a light weight show hunter, but against a heavy weight hunter he looks out of place. I think the Australian Hunter Association is going to be a huge benefit to sorting out Australian hunters! Lets hope its inaugural show is well supported. P.C

When I first started showing, I had no idea how corrupt this sport actually was well I thought it was only a one off anyway I did hear a story this was going back several years  before the rules changed, anyway the story goes that a  child rider knew the judge in the ring, the ring had already started rider asked dad 'hey lets hurry we can make the class' dad answers 'no we won't rush' meanwhile in the ring the riders just kept going round and round, later in the day the judge goes to the dad 'i was holding the ring up for you, I was going to give you first place'! so really  my parents who don't show, never have and never will, it was a 'Well that's no suprise is it? Why are you even bothering' they often remind me of that story to! This sport especially at small shows heavily relies on honestly, pure honesty! now how many people are truely honest with themselves in the show ring? competing under judges they know, drugging there horses? competing in a second ring when the rules clearly state you can't! Now I doubt there ever will be a way to prove that a person knows a judge quite well. I guess the only thing you could do is put in a protest, and/or complain to the cheif steward, and the show hack council.  Drugging of horses? well it would be nice if people were swabbed and caught and baned as it clearly states in the show hack council rules. But those people will just ride the horse to the ground before the event at the shows where they do test them. It makes me extrememly angry and upset that I am up against people that are corrupt! I say to you if you are, why are you scared to be honest? but I pretty much here the answer all ready 'I need a performance for the royal and HOTY!' well I can say to that...you really don't deserve to be there if your dishonest and make it very obvious!  Name Witheld NSW

OTHER RECENT VIEWER TOPICS

With the rules of the show hunter classes not to far away from being changed by the Australian Hunter Horse Association which will require your horse/pony registered with them, your horse/pony will have to go under an assessment. One would hope that because of this, this will stop the finer built, finer breed ones from entering!  I sent a photo of my pony as I was unsure if she was a hunter or not, I was 60 % sure she was a hack, but some older style show people I know all said she was a hunter, it was decided that she is a hack, I can defineatly see she is hack, because when she moves she would rather extend trot, then extend canter! whereas my other one is the exact opposite, he would rather run as fast as he can (mind you he decided  to be a sporting pony at the last show I went, first reaction was 'crap I've screwed up' a second later I was literally killing myself laughing! then came back and went 'ooops!' that seemed to happen in quite a few classes to!) I think also the open hack class judges need to open up a little on what they accept as an open and hunter, just because there are ponies that are more rounder then the extremely thinly built ones, doesn't mean that they are no good as open!  it would almost be discrimination if one only ever picks a specific breed only in open classes. If a judged ever told me that I was a hunter I would propeberly snap! and I would be tempted to say as well 'actually this one does have riding pony in it! only a very small amount!' but I certainly wouldn't stop competing in the open classes. Name Witheld.

On behalf of the committe of  Minto Show we would like to thank all our Judges, Stewards. helpers & competitors for making our weekend a huge success. It was beautiful weather (finally) & the  horses that competed on both days were of outstanding quality. I hope everyone had a great weekend & congratulations to all winners. Also thank you to all the Dads that gave up their Fathers day to tag along with their children or gave them a "leave"  pass to go along to the show. Hope you all had a wonderful Fathers Day!! We have moved the date for our annual show for 2010 back to it's orginal November weekend. The date for next year will be 13th & 14th of November. Cheers Sharyn - Show Secretary

Again I must raise the issue of the FINE riding ponies coming over into the show hunters. You have your classes in the open- give us a fair go! I would be in the open ring if I could but some opinionated judge told me my pony was "True welsh type" and didnt belong in the open ring " even tough he won his open class every time till this one judged."well they are mainly riding ponies arent they' was he comment. Well! Hunters are mainly welsh so what can you do.
To Make things worse you get judges like the one we had on the weekend who actually put these ponies up over hunters like she was judging an open class and this is most unfair. Anyway,the opens usually hve more classes for the ponies and the hunters get one and ifl lucky may get two.
I totally get it that some ponies registered as riding ponies-not bred.For example,I think I could get my pony done,but I do stand to correction on this if I am wrong. But the true fine elegant bred riding pony has no place inthe hunters. This is a lot of work and costs the same as anyone else in petrol etc so give us a go. Name Witheld

I completely agree with this. Why can't someone just be happy with riding or leding their own horse! Why fly handlers or riders all over the country for the sake of them showing your horse for you, all because they may know or be friends with the judge. It's you who pays for your horse, feeds your horse, shoes your horse, takes care of your horse, so why not actually show your own horse. It's a ribbon and sure it's one that we all want every weekend but surely it comes with more satisfaction if you do it yourself rather than pay for the ribbon!!!  Owner/Rider NSW

In response to comments on lack of attendance and people becoming disgruntled and opting not to go.  I have another point to add and I am not sure if I am the only one who feels this way but one of my main reason's for not going was that I do not feel welcome at SHCQ shows, these shows seem to be too clicky.  I always seem to get allocated the not so good stables even when I send in my entries earlier than most. I pay just as much as anyone else yet don't seem to get the same service as the more popular competitors. I feel that those on the committee should try a bit of PR and get out there and introduce themselves to the competitors who they do not know or have never been introduced to and make them feel a bit more welcome.  This sort of approach would take away that clicky mentality and make others more comfortable, these sort of shows should have us counting the days and being excited to attend instead of dreading it. Thanks Name Witheld QLD

I would like you to put on site that it would be nice for the committee to come over and thank the stalls and all of the Sponsors that are continually asked to help the shows with donations and prizes for free, as we support them with large donations as we don't get our sites for nothing. Some parts of these events are not professionally run and I agree with the person about the allocation of the stabling - stables should be put in a hat and drawn out fairly or by distance travelled by competitors and not always allocated to the committee. Thank you. Bob QLD

Not sure what catalogue (Name Witheld Qld) was looking in but the smallest class in the Catalogue for the QLD Country Hack Championships was seven.  Some people did choose not to attend for reasons of their own, but on the whole SHCQ was extremely happy with the number and quality of entrants received.  Yes, there were low numbers in some of the immediate classes, however, these are not GN qualifying events.  I would like to congratulate all competitors, judges, sponsors and committee members for a great, harmonious show. – Rachael Douglas QLD 

Hi, I would just like to say well done to the Committee of the Championships, it was a very well run event, with great prizes and dispite the rain was a lovely show to attend. Thanks. Sam QLD

Just wondering how a GN Qualifier can attract such little entries. I was not competing as already qualified however looking here through the catalogue to see 2 - 7 in most classes is appaulling! Hacks hack a little more in each of their classes however it's obviously a case of judges, cost of travelling or entering or maybe other choosing to go to an Ag show for a performance instead. Not sour grapes however I was fortunate enough to qualify for the GN at a royal show, with many many entries. It seems disappointing that I will share company at the Grand National with some that seemed to qualify with such eas or due to lack of entries. Please note this is in no way disrespect to those who won, I congratulate you all, however just merely a feeling and visualisation on my part. Name witheld QLD

Hi Emma - I know this has been done so many times before however can the SHC please adopt a system whereby a 3rd place getter can maybe also qualify to attend the Grand Nationals when the Champion and Reserve have already qualified. I have now 3 times been so close to the main award and been beaten by someone who is already in and mulitiple times. When you see the score sheets, its not a case of "maybe I'm not good enought' as some may say however to come that close to the same horses is very frustrating and now I only have the HOY show as my final chance up here and everyone knows some of our big shows can be set up. So I really do ask for the SHC to look at this and many are becoming disgruntled and not attending these shows and there's really no point anymore. That's maybe why there was hardly anyone there. Thanks Disappointed Again QLD

How can we stop corruption in the Horse World. To see friends blatenly go under other good friends and surprise surprise leave the ring with a broad ribbon - AFTER having a long chat about the next social outing is just not right. If you know the judge - at least have some professionalism to refrain from everyday conversation whilst being sashed.  It's also very noticeable when a judge gives someone a broad ribbon or performance, as they know that person is judging the next show - it's obvious to everyone at the show, so please stop it. We need a way of making judges announce why they gave someone a win - not mentioning faults of other animals, however really showing to the competitors and spectators why the horse won. Name Witheld NSW

It was evident at a large Show in QLD this weekend. Showies either saying it's too expensive to go, or not worth the time as you know who's going to win anyway, or choosing simple enter on the day shows. Money is sacred these days and we don't want to through it away on red ribbons. Sorry but its just reality, if your not thinking you will have a reasonable chance, why waist money, go out to dinner instead! S.N

Hi Emma, I've read in your NSW programs pages many of your shows are being cancelled due to lack of entries, I wonder if this is now a sign of the times that people can't afford to part with large amounts of money so far in advance for some events, then at the risk of bad weather, horse or rider illness or othe circumstances to then have thrown their money away. I have also not entered many shows that I would normally do as the cost for all of them is simply to high, in some instances by the time you add up all the fees not including the class fee, sometimes it can be upwards of $100.00 plus just for one class at the end of the day. What really do we get back from that? Many are not after fancy prizes, trophies etc more for the title of the Show and a nice ribbon, but sometimes $40 or $50 plus for each event is what puts many off. Surely in today's technology world there is a way we can still pre-enter online with shows however without the requirement of it being so far in advance and with some costs lowered. Thank you for your time. M.K.

I found out that a show that isn't to far away (bulli) is going ahead but with no horses! this is the second time this has happened! now this how as I remember had two rings as well, which would be great for those who are trying to get a performance for royals. It is 'rummored' the reason behind no horses is because on the committee there are no people who 'like' horses! Now whatever the reason behind them no putting it on...I still think the horses should be put on...what's an ag show without horses? luckly this year another show society has put another show on, they normally don't...but if they didn't I think it is unfair on those who are trying to get a perforance to have one less chance! I am very keen to have the society put back on the horses next year, however I don't know how I can do it...especially by myself! Was thinking along the lines of maybe a petition or something(????). Last time they did try and put on the classes they were after a chief steward, now all they did was advertise in the local sadderly...I was going to rip it down and send it in to this website and see if someone could help but I simply didn't have the nerve to do it! I am hoping that people might have some ideas on how to approach and get the horses back in. I think it would be to late to try for this year! Bron NSW

Personally i think that if your horse is educated enough it shuould be able to do flying changes. People have commented that flying changes are dressage moves  and sholdnt be used in the show ring, - what about lenghten trots? It shouldnt matter what class your in , whether it be open hack , hunter ,ASH, ANSA if your asked to do a fly, you should be able to do it unless your horse is only green . If your horse is a ASH you need to be able to do flying changes otherwise you wont go any good. How are you ment to chase a beast ? stop and do a simple change everytime the beast changes direction?  I think that if there was a class full of top quality hacks they should be able to fly, even more when competing at royal and HOTY shows . Like i have said i think that Show horses should be asked to do flys. All horses once old enough should be taught.  It could win you the class ! Remember -   A nice fly will always beat a simple , but a nice simple will always beat a messy fly.  Name Witheld NSW

The committee of Hunter Valley Arabians Inc would like to thank everyone for a great day at The Hunter Valley Spring Show, despite the wind. We would like to especially thank our judges, sponsors and volunteers for their assistance. Without them we wouldn’t have a show. Full results and photos will appear on the website shortly. Thanks to Lorelle Mercer for covering the show, proofs will be posted to her website.  Finally a reminder that we are holding our annual Hunter Valley All Arabian Show along with the Hunter Valley Breed Show on October 25th, entries close September 25th. We really enjoy holding our shows but we are a small club and need competitors to support us with entries. This is one of the last remaining A class Arabian shows in regional NSW. Please see Emma’s Program page for details. Sharon Finlay

The SHC rule 5.1 (c) states that the Competitor/Exhibitor/Exhibit is INELIGIBLE to compete if the Competitor/Exhibitor/Owner or his family has provided accommodation for the Judge immediately prior to or during the Show or vice versa. But where is the rule that Competitors/Exhibitors/Owners cannot have dinner with the Judge/s the night before competition day? Is this not closely related to rule 5.1 (c)? Also, should there be a rule where officials or their family members cannot own/show the Exhibit that is competing under the judge they are stewarding for? -Curious, NSW

It has come to our attention that Memberships and Registrations are being delayed at the RPSBS Head Office. If you are waiting for this information to come through before sending in your Riding Pony Entries, please send them anyway with a note attached if you are one of the many waiting and we will still process your entries and follow up on your details with Head office after the closing date, It would be greatful if this information could be passed on to any members you know of in this situation but do not have access to the Internet to see this message.Melissa McVeagh 

For those that are wondering why they cannot compete in the 2nd and 3rd ring if they have already come first in the 1st ring, think of it this way – the ONLY reason why shows have extra chances is to provide a service to those seeking performances for Royals.  It makes their show more attractive, increasing attendances and revenue.  If the extra rings did not provide the extra performance opportunities then there would be no attraction, and even no need to run them.  Why would shows put the extra rings on, with the extra burden for ribbons and judges if it was not for the fact of providing extra performance opportunities.  Before the days of 2 and 3 ring circuses – whether there for fun or enjoyment (or hopefully both) – you only had one ring so for those that win in that ring, you have not lost any benefit by the improvements in performance opportunities.  [In relation to the comment about adults and childs class winners still being allowed to compete, - this is straightforward.  You can only count one of these type of classes in your list of performances, so it is a “fall back” class.  It is better in every show to gain an open win. ] JL NSW

What do competitors think of pre entries to shows? I find if taking only one horse and no helper,it can be hard to leave the horse unattended while i go and get tickets etc. I do realise it will be more work for secretaries,but on the other hand they will have money coming in, in advance. If Emma could supply a waiver form to download and send with entries-it would save everyone quite a bit of time i am sure.Just asking others opinion? Then either supply a delegate where the prepaid tickets can be picked up-or better still posted ,which the pre-enters would supply a stamped self addressed envelope. Name Witheld

Response to Jeremy - Jeremy definitely not sour grapes, you are very defensive,  if you re read my post you will see I am not questioning his integrity nor am I questioning his actions or his decisions ( I totally agreed with his choices)  but I disagree with the RNA’s  decisions to do this  as rules should be for all  not for some  and it is certainly not the normal thing to ask a  judge to judge   the same section again in such a short time frame nor be a competitor at that show. I have  written to the RNA  about issues and also have previously offered sponsorship from 2companies   for added classes and classes already there  for one I had no reply at all and the other  was knocked back due to timetable  issues they said (which was fair enough)   then  all of a sudden there are some new classes added  so go figure  but please re read my post  before  jumping into accusations  and take that judge out of the picture  and have a think would you like to be judged by the same judge  again the next year  and if this becomes the normal procedure  across the show  only the winners or people with new horses need bother to enter .  Luckily we have Emmas site to put suggestions and speak freely. Name Witheld NSW

HI Emma, In reply to the posts about double & triple chance shows. "Graham Davey and Corinne Tydens from the RAS of NSW attended the Ag Socities Council meeting on 26.8.09 and they confirmed that the RAS takes only 1 performance from these types of shows.  That is why, as a show secretary, when we have the Betty J. Tupper Memorial Spring Show, we  have that if a competitor wins a 1st in an open class, Champion or Reserve in Ring 1 they cannot compete in Ring 2.  We also have that if a competitor wins a class, they cannont compete in the extra open class in the rings. This way it allows more competitors to obtain a performance for Sydney at  this show.  Most shows in NSW have a similar wording.   Helen Kirton, ASC Delegate.

I got rather upset and angered by the comment, " In other cases i know some people go out to a show just for the shear joy of showing - but these people need to realize that the 3 ring circus is there to give other people a chance to win there class.:" I myself imediately thought  "they scared of little 'competiton?" now I would hope I have misinterpreted that (I will be crossing my arms, legs and fingures and toes!). My other thoughts were "is this comment aimed at people like me who show for the fun of it? should I be 'not allowed' in because I am showing for pleasure and the possibliy of getting a ribbion to hang in my room on the wall?" Why should I be not equally be entitled to that 1st place, even though I might not be aiming for royals, HOTY this particular year?"  It would be nice if this person (and others along the same thought path) actually gave people like myself who dont have really any experience showing at all, some 'hints and tips'. Some of us have never riden at royals, HOTY, not even won a champion ribbion or even one a first place (other then automatically because there are no riders (never been a class that's contributed to Champion)!  Name withheld

I believe that the whole situation for a 3 ring circus is to give other people a chance to qualify there horses. It gives more than one person on the day to get performance for there horse. The 3 ring circus is a great idea. If you have your win in the first ring, why would you need to go in either the 2nd or 3rd ring??? you have your performance, why go in the other rings and take someone elses chance to get there win for the day. As we all know these days it getting harder and harder to qualify for our Royals and HOTY's. It gives the other people a chance to qualify. We all go to our Ag shows for a reason - To qualify for the big ones! In other cases i know some people go out to a show just for the shear joy of showing - but these people need to realize that the 3 ring circus is there to give other people a chance to win there class. J NSW Hackie

Following discussions re: Brisbane Royal and the letter written by someone who seems to have an issue with several things, but who appears to remain anonymous. Let me start with the topic of the judge for the Best Dressed Strapper in the led thoroughbred classes. The judge of these classes is a good friend of mine, and I wish to let you know that despite your comments, he is one of the most genuine people you will find in the horse showing society.
You have stated that he was a competitor at this show and also a judge, and this being the second year running he judged the same class. Yes, these facts are true, but let me assure you that the RNA asked him to judge this class again, and they were completely aware of his intentions to compete at the show. Being a well-known identity and a person who is synonymous with high standards, it was a choice the RNA made for their own reasons including to help increase the profile of the sport, and one I am sure many people would have been happy with. As a competitor and judge he maintains professionalism and his integrity should not be brought into question. By questioning the actions of this judge though, you are also questioning the standard of the winners. As a competitor in the assigned Best Dressed Strapper class I was VERY impressed with the outfit of the first placegetter. Dressed very demurely she was a stand-out winner and I am sure an easy decision that would have been made by BOTH judges.

It seems to me a case of sour grapes. The choices made by the RNA in regard to breeds and classes held for them I reiterate what I have said earlier – cough up the cash to sponsor these classes, and I am sure the forward thinking RNA will be happy to cater. Your arguments for the addition of classes could continue for days, but ultimately without a sponsor these don’t just happen. Furthermore, if you have such emotion in regard to your issues, and they would be better for the sport, I suggest you put pen to paper as I have, and send a letter to the Horse Committee of the RNA for consideration.  You have mentioned that without comments speaking up then things won’t improve – well they won’t improve if you aren’t willing to put your name behind your opinion. Just some constructive thoughts.  Jeremy Roberts

I certainly understand the plight of many Showies at this time of year as I myself have a team of 4+ ponies and hopefully this will help as I will accept Riding Ponies Show Entries up to Friday the 11th September.I don't want to see people go hungry for the sake of entering ours show!!
Melissa McVeagh - Show Secretary (RPSBS NSW Branch)

Hi ESH - can I ask your viewers to write in to your offices and assure me that I am not the only one out in the Show world not entering many pre enter shows just due to the sheer cost by the time you ad it all up. After Canberra Royal, Riding Pony Show, HOY, Breed Shows and other things I am almost up for $2300 just for two horses. I know our sport is the sport of Kings, however I am very much feeling like the porper that can't afford to do it anymore. Catch is if you don't enter some of these fancy events, your horses becomes not worth as much? Is that right? I think like many I hope, I am really picking and choosing as to what to enter and is it worth it or not. Money just simply is not too hard to find, especially when you have to pay some shows 4 months ahead and they take your money, while I'm left to starve! Thanks. Hackie come begger in the street NSW.

Why exactly can't a winner from one ring go in another? Why should they be excluded from going in up to 2 other rings, when those who win an Adults or Childs can still go in other rings. I believe all 3 rings should be open to all competitors at the show, regardless of their results from 1st or 2nd rings. Im tired of going all that way to a show, and paying the same amount to be there, winning my open and then being stuck with one class for the day. Doesn't make very fair. Allow everyone to compete in all of them and it will make for a fairer competition for the entire day! Mark

I would like to  chat on some concerning issues at the recent  Brisbane Royal and I am must say that we had a great show in total so am not winging because we didn’t do well just some issues that need addressing and if we don’t speak up about such things they will never improve  No  section should  be judged by the same judge as did the event in recent years  and also NOT  by a person that is competing at the show and at the stables with their horse each day  other judges cant socialise with competitors prior to their judging commitments it is just not the thing to do it leaves it wide open for complaints  ( the class being  Tbred best dressed and handlers)

On the ridden T/breds these should be done as a breed ( great for sponsors of the led sections to then see them go around under saddle)and  therefore must be registered ( most hacks are anyway)  Hacks have all their other classes to compete in   It is great to see led & ridden in all breed sections as it is good to showcase each  breed  and that should also include stallion riddens   Talking on stallion riddens  Brisbane seems to discriminative against them  as in ASH classes there is not a hack ridden for them either as there is for Mares & Geldings they could open it to Stallions Mares & geldings  if there is not time to add an extra class same as for the T/breds.  Things should be  the same across the board for all  you can’t breed without stallions so they need to have the opportunity to be promoted they should stop treating them like they are lepers 

Secondly  there is no show in  Australia that  sees fit to change judges as  they please even the minute prior to judging can you imagine if they did this in the hack ring  there would be an uproar (even if  the ring is running late) there was a different judge start a section ( not the judge that was advertised as she was running late judging another section)then to have that judge come in and take over mid way  ending up with  different types then leaving the one judge to judge the Champion (they should at least have had  both judges in for the Champion )  Bringing me to another issue why is it needed to have 3 judges to do the T/bred classes ( if they say due to there being racing and hacking types they are still all t/breds same as say all Australian Saddle Ponies  or ANSA or ASH  you have hack and racing types in T/breds and in ASH  you have show and working types ANSA you have Galloway’s  & Hacks  ASPA you have  all Aussie ponies and riding ponies  also All of these could have 2 judges also but there is only one judge in those sections T/breds should be the same   Surely it would be easier for all  rather than have confusion all around ( as no one judge judges the same  I know I would be much happier to have a stallion mare and Gelding of similar type that I like when it comes to judging the Champion or Supreme but……  if they MUST have several judges in a champion or a Supreme then the JUDGES  should NOT ever stand together to discuss it their stewards should write the judges choices in order  down on paper to get the winner  then and only then can  the judges  discuss it . 

All of  these occurrences are just not fair on competitors.It is such a shame to spoil such a good show with such unprofessionalism they need to move ahead not backwards and I hope they can take constructive criticism and discuss these issues for the benefit of a better show. Name withheld  NSW

Hi Emma Just a quick comment to Deb regarding the Leading Rein Classes at a show at the weekend.  Deb your correct in your comment regarding the First Place Getter in the Leading Rein and the Champion, it was dragging its leader around, also the 2nd in the Riding pony ring was what you would call hot.  However the Runner Up Leading rein pony, displayed a soft trot , tractable nature and sat softly in the bridle for its little 4 year old rider .  I'm not sure what you saw in the open class but thats how it was.  The comment from the judge in the Riding Pony Lead rein class that she wasn't looking for manners, was looking for quality showed his complete inexperience in this field. Regards LR

I saw on at a weekend show the lead rein pony classes both Riding Pony and Open and noted with interest that there seems to be a strong enfaces on type rather than suitability of pony to carry a small child safely around the ring.  Can someone, maybe a judge, tell me exactly what should the priority be when looking at these classes.  Don't get me wrong the two top place getters in the class are of exceptional type as far as a led and open ridden pony goes, but when it comes to lead rein these ponies were forward, naughty during workout, pulled reins from the childrens hands, and could not stand still in the line up for a moment.  The same pony won the open and went almost the entire workout on a tight lead from the handler being held back and the handler had to use his right arm to push the pony in the right direction.  The pony in third place was not touched once by his handler and worked beautifuly on a loose lead all the way around.  It takes hours of hard work and preparation for these lead rein classes and I think these sometimes lesser quality but extremely safe and well mannered ponies deserve a go in what is meant to be an overall package of suitability, safety, manners, paces and presentation.  Correct me if I am wrong!  Deb

On behalf of the Bedgerebong Show committee we would like to thank Emmas Show Horses for the advertisement, and most important our horse competitors.  Without you we do not have a show so Thank you. Bedgerebong Show Committee.

The Sydney Regional APSB Sub Group would like to acknowledge and thank those who attended our Show at Luddenham yesterday. The show was a relaxed affair and around most rings appeared to be quite social and relaxed. We could not have asked for better weather and numbers were high in many "pony" sections. No doubt, the Arabian Riding Ponies will require an extended program in 2010. I personally witnessed the Champion Arabian Riding Pony lineup and it was worthy or any Royal Show Championship. Due to the high number of entries, the Riding Pony program will also be extended and the Miniature Horses and Ponies will have their own ring. Our show is run by a small group of volunteers who gave up their Sunday to come and run this show for you so thankyou to the volunteers who are not on our group who came and helped who I am sure would have preferred to have been enjoying such a nice day anywhere but at a horse show, without them, the show would not happen, 98% of those who attended made it a pleasant and worthwhile day for us..  Thank you to our Announcer Katrina Wodja who went well beyond her call of duty and doubled as a Steward at some stages of the day, to our sponsors as without your support, our show would just be like any other show but with your generosity we are able to offer a fantastic prize pool of which we received many positive comments.

Thankyou to our Judges and Stewards, some of whom travelled for several hours to judge for little or no cost to our group. We have a huge program to get through and all rings ran smoothly and efficiently with some lovely ponies walking away with the major sashes. Lorelle Mercer was in attendance with her trusty camera. One can always be sure of a good shot from Lorelle so please visit her website and have a look for your pics from the show.... Again, Lorelle attended at no cost to our group so please support her business to ensure she returns next year!! We conducted a brief survey as to where the show will be held next year (Hawkesbury or Luddenham). The results have come back and the scale has tipped slightly towards Luddenham again. The date of next years show wll be August 22, 2010. Thankyou to those who participated and we really appreciated your input. See you all next year!! Melissa McVeagh

I read with interest the comments made about the TB classes at this years show. I was under the impression that if you have brought, trained received lessons or are related or similar to the judge you are unable to compete under that judge before a 3 month period. So i come to wonder how one of the TB winners was trained and had its latest race start under the judge no less than 6 weeks prior to judging day. The judges are released before nominations close for the TB's so it was not a case of not knowing who the judge was. I wonder if the rules for the TB are different even though being a royal show than any other show or breeds? Was this horse right to compete or am i the only one who found this very strange and unfair to other competiors?? Just wondering what other people think on this subject? Interested Observer, QLD

It is interesting to read the comments on this forum in regard to the EKKA, and I offer my understanding and opinion.
Firstly, in regard to “other” breeds competing in the class for horses of thoroughbred type - The horse which won the class is indeed a stockhorse/thoroughbred cross, but as has been proven time and time again, he has qualities that many judges consider to be of thoroughbred type. Not only was this horse a winner at Brisbane Royal this year, he has, amongst other ‘tb’ wins, won The Pope Cup at one of the most prestigious Royal Shows in this country – Sydney Royal. It is also interesting to note that the second placegetter in this class is in fact Riding Pony/Part Welsh bred, and has also accumulated success amongst other open, and what some may call more ‘thoroughbred’ type. As has been mentioned, the class is open to anyone who considers their horse to have thoroughbred qualities, and the decision on the day is up to the judge. The class itself is not restrictive, and the competitor has the option to enter the class. To those who consider this “unfair” then I suggest one thing – that you approach the RNA of QLD and sponsor the class yourself, and ask them to change the class description. Until then, leave the judging to the person standing in the middle of the ring.

Secondly, there seems to be some confusion when it comes to open show horses vs show hunters. I believe Brisbane Royal is making very good progress in regard to competitor enjoyment, and this will undoubtedly improve as the showground developments take place. I do however believe that the addition of “show hunter” classes needs revision.  Before the introduction of the lightweight/heavyweight hunter classes at Brisbane Royal, classes were held for height and weight restrictions. In the hack classes, all horses entered in 10, 12 or 14 stone hack classes, as they once were, fronted before the judge to be classified in the ring before the weight classes were conducted. The description for this was that the horse be suitable to carry a rider of 10, 12 or 14 stone.

In recent years, these weight restrictive classes were changed, with the addition of the words show hunter – and in my opinion something that should never happened. Rather, a separate championship should be held much the same as other royal shows such as Sydney Royal. A lightweight open Galloway, is not, and should not be shown as, a show hunter. Heavyweights can often be considered show hunters, but it is advantageous for the competitor and the sport, that the horse be compared to the standard of excellence for show hunters, and is not, as is often the case, shown in show hunter classes because it is not competitive enough for the open ring. Unfortunately in Australia, horses of true show hunter type are not as established as in the UK and therefore the grey line exists. The Hunter Horse Association of Australia is to be commended for making progress in this area and I look forward to hearing more about what this newly formed association has to offer. Once again, while the class is not restrictive this enables competitors to enter both open and show hunter classes. As has been suggested though, competitors should write to the RNA and suggest making a separate show hunter championship. There is little use venting behind floats, and or computer screens! Food for thought!  Jeremy Roberts

Dear ESH - I would like to reply to Amanda QLD & J.P re: their comments about the ridden HACK showing T/B QUALITY classes held at Brisbane Royal.
These classes have always been just that - a HACK showing T/B qualities - not a ridden T/B class. I can appreciate you are both entitled to your opinions, however having said that - J.P has stated that the winner does not show T/B qualities for the class purpose - as J.P has not actually identified themselves its hard to gauge if they are even qualified to make that comment!  I would like to bring to the attention of J.P & Amanda QLD that this particular horse - even though you have not actually named him, there would be few people (in show circles) that wouldnt know who you were referring to - has won this class & been awarded Champion Hack Showing T/B Qualites Three times at Brisbane Royal (this year the gelding class entries were aprox 89) & has also won the Pope Cup at Sydney Royal - another Hack showing T/B quality class( entries were also aprox 85). So all those different Royal, national & internationally qualified judges have awarded this particular horse over & over again as a Hack showing T/B qualities. I myself can see a pattern. As much as he is a registered Australian Stock horse - a fact we are very proud of, if the time was taken to view his pedigree, you would see the strong T/B connection.  He is also ANSA registered, do you both feel this should eliminate him as well?? As with the second place getter - he also has strong T/B breeding. Have a look at the top 7 place getters in this class - over half were non registered T/B - Im sure their owners & connections would be thrilled to hear your words of wisdom about their horses as well! As for the statement by Amanda QLD that "its not really the competitors fault as they are going through a loop hole created for them" - I find this offensive & liable. At the end of the day both the winner of the gelding class & the 2nd place getter are childrens pets (more like family members) that they work very hard with & love adoringly, regardless of what colour ribbon they may or may not win. I feel this may be a case of show people not wishing the best for their fellow competitors - how sad. If Amanda QLD or J.P would like to introduce themselves to us we would be more that happy to show them pedigrees of both these horses & then they may have a better understanding of the strong T/B connections.